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Friday, Nov. 28, 2014

Change that your kids will HAVE to believe in…

Posted Friday, November 7, 2008, at 1:04 PM

Well, we're starting to see what kind of "change" that many of you folks voted for last week. This is from a new government website called www.change.gov, where you get to see what your new president has planned for you and your children.

From America Serves:

"When you choose to serve -- whether it's your nation, your community or simply your neighborhood -- you are connected to that fundamental American ideal that we want life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness not just for ourselves, but for all Americans. That's why it's called the American dream."

The Obama Administration will call on Americans to serve in order to meet the nation's challenges. President-Elect Obama will expand national service programs like AmeriCorps and Peace Corps and will create a new Classroom Corps to help teachers in underserved schools, as well as a new Health Corps, Clean Energy Corps, and Veterans Corps. Obama will call on citizens of all ages to serve America, by developing a plan to require 50 hours of community service in middle school and high school and 100 hours of community service in college every year. Obama will encourage retiring Americans to serve by improving programs available for individuals over age 55, while at the same time promoting youth programs such as Youth Build and Head Start.

Requiring hours of community service is what I hear over in General Sessions court every week when sentences are issued for crimes. Now, it may be mandated to your kids.

It's not like this idea is new. Obama's new Chief of Staff, Rep. Rahm Emanuel, put this concept in his book, "The Plan. It's on pages 61-62 and reads:

It's time for a real Patriot Act that brings out the patriot in all of us. We propose universal civilian service for every young American. Under this plan, All Americans between the ages of eighteen and twenty-five will be asked to serve their country by going through three months of basic training, civil defense preparation and community service. ...

Here's how it would work. Young people will know that between the ages of eighteen and twenty-five, the nation will enlist them for three months of civilian service. They'll be asked to report for three months of basic civil defense training in their state or community, where they will learn what to do in the event of biochemical, nuclear or conventional attack; how to assist others in an evacuation; how to respond when a levee breaks or we're hit by a natural disaster. These young people will be available to address their communities' most pressing needs.

This isn't a wacked out conspiracy theory. It's on Obama's new website and in his new Chief of Staff's book.

I don't know about you guys, but I feel a draft…

Was this the type of "change" all of you voted for? Discuss.

UPDATE: 7 a.m. 11/8/08

Since I and others bloggers posted items drawing attention to this Friday, the change.gov website has ... changed, removing all mentions of a requirement.

Details here. This contains a link to the Google cache, so there can be no doubt.

Screen shots here.


Comments
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as many people that complain about 'kids nowadays,' you'd think the country would be behind someting like this. put them to work, instill community values and just values in general. Conscription isn't the worst thing to happen to a person.

-- Posted by jtm2y on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 1:48 PM

I would say the largest amount of people who voted for Obama, did not have a clue where he stood on the issues or of his plans for America. If anyone asked any questions about what changes we were to expect, we were racist or told to shut our mouth. So most people do not have a clue what kind of "change" they voted for, but they sure are happy about it.

-- Posted by greasemonkey on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 1:51 PM

Just to be fair.. most people who voted for McCain or any other candidate for that matter were also unaware of candidates' stances on issues. For the most part, voters generally do not educate themselves before doing so.

-- Posted by jtm2y on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 1:55 PM

All I can do is shake my head greasemonkey . . . .

-- Posted by jaxspike on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 2:00 PM

i am so confused.

for months i have been reading ya'lls warnings that obama was going to give everyone money without making them work.

now you are warning me that he is going to make people work.

horrors, imagine making young people contribute to their country. how are we supposed to properly teach them selfishness at home?

ya'll are hilarious. we libertarians are old hands at not getting our way in the elections. we vote for who we believe in, and when our guy doesnt win, we judge the winner by what he does.

oh, for what it is worth i generally spend 500-1,000 hours a year doing volunteer work. back when i was a kid, making a contribution to the community was a conservative value. if this is true, it sounds like a winner to me.

-- Posted by lazarus on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 2:23 PM

I agree that volunteer work and contributing to the community are a great thing for kids. Forcing someone to contribute to the community, thats kinda crazy. I can hear the little kids now marching in formation, arm stuck in the air with fingers forward, crying HEIL OBAMA, HEIL OBAMA!!!!

-- Posted by greasemonkey on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 2:29 PM

Students would be paying for college by doing the community service.

"Create the American Opportunity Tax Credit: Obama and Biden will make college affordable for all Americans by creating a new American Opportunity Tax Credit. This universal and fully refundable credit will ensure that the first $4,000 of a college education is completely free for most Americans, and will cover two-thirds the cost of tuition at the average public college or university and make community college tuition completely free for most students. Recipients of the credit will be required to conduct 100 hours of community service."

-- Posted by Richard on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 2:47 PM

This plan is the kind of change this nation needs. Many people on this very website have voiced the opinion that Obama will create an environment in America where even more people look to the government for answers. This program shows that Obama is doing exactly the opposite and that he is a proactive leader. If the youth of our nation is trained to perform certain responsibilities during a disaster, they will not stand by and wait for FEMA or some other government agency to come and save them. Our nation is full of intelligent and capable youth, but with the exception of the military, there is not many options that allows them to give back. Attending a few weeks of civil service training is a small price to pay to a nation that has given them so much.

-- Posted by nathan.evans on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 3:12 PM

The same people that seem the be endorsing community service idea by Obama were the same ones whining about the standard school attire and . . . got to love irony.

-- Posted by jaxspike on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 3:24 PM

nathan,

Are you seriously supporting this or is it a weak attempt at sarcasm? I am asking because I seriously am not sure. I cant see anyone really supporting this and being serious.

-- Posted by greasemonkey on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 3:27 PM

jaxspike this really has nothing to do with Standard School Attire.

If these kids can do community serivce work and pay for some of their college I think that is wonderful. And it sure beats the heck out of getting freebie grants that your taxes are paying for anyway without them lifting a finger.

Standard School Attire cost people more money to send their children to Public School in which my tax dollars are paying for anyway.

We all know I didn't vote for Obama but I do like this idea

-- Posted by Dianatn on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 3:36 PM

The same people that seem the be endorsing community service idea by Obama were the same ones whining about the standard school attire and . . . got to love irony.

-- Posted by jaxspike on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 3:24 PM

Please provide some details to back up your claim Jaxspike because I fail to see the irony in this.

-- Posted by nathan.evans on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 3:39 PM

nathan,

Are you seriously supporting this or is it a weak attempt at sarcasm? I am asking because I seriously am not sure. I cant see anyone really supporting this and being serious.

-- Posted by greasemonkey on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 3:27 PM

Yes greasemonkey I support this.

-- Posted by nathan.evans on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 3:45 PM

I have to say that I was not and am not on the Obama bandwagon yet, but I do like this idea. My only reservation is that I would want to be certain that there is no political indoctrination that goes along with the service

-- Posted by devan on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 4:02 PM

What is the punishment if you do not want to participate? What is the punishment if you do not, for whatever reason, you do not want your kids to participate? What do all these different "corps" do? What is "community service" exactly and what limits are put into its definition? On what part of our flag will the hammer and scicle go?

-- Posted by greasemonkey on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 4:45 PM

"Create the American Opportunity Tax Credit: Obama and Biden will make college affordable for all Americans by creating a new American Opportunity Tax Credit. This universal and fully refundable credit will ensure that the first $4,000 of a college education is completely free for most Americans, and will cover two-thirds the cost of tuition at the average public college or university and make community college tuition completely free for most students. Recipients of the credit will be required to conduct 100 hours of community service"

Community service or none, the government should not be paying for one's college education. Families have 18 years to decide how they will pay for college, it is their own fault if they can't. If finances are truly that tight then kids should hit the books in order to win merit based scholarhips.It's not that difficult.

I attended both private and public universities and graduate school, and my parents made sure I did not rely on the government for my education. It is simply a matter of commitment and planning that too people many fail to do.

-- Posted by gottago on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 5:08 PM

It's really hard for people to plan for College for their children when it takes every dime they make to live but I guess you think those children do not deserve the right to go to college because they are poor? Surely you do not think children should suffer because of their parents inability to save for college? Every child may not be able to get a scholarship and even if they do very few scholarships even come close to paying full tuition.

-- Posted by Dianatn on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 5:44 PM

Dianatn,

I understand that it is a struggle for some to pay for college. I knew many students who worked full time to put themselves through school. They did this because they appreciated the value of an education and knew that value was depreciated when the government picked up the tab. Full time employment is still very common on many university campuses. Students not only work but continue with demanding the majors that so many students are afraid to even attempt.

I know it sounds harsh, but there are certain responsibilities one has when they bring children in the world. Be able to pay for them or don't have them.

-- Posted by gottago on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 6:00 PM

I totally agree people do need to be able to support and care for their children before they have them but we can not make the children that are here suffer for their parents mistakes. There just isn't many people these days that have an extra $40,000 to $60,000 laying around for their child to go to college. By not giving these children a chance at college we are just producing more and more factory workers instead of higher paid job seekers. Of course there is always the option of Student Loans which is the way most children go to college but then you are paying for a loan for years to come once you get out of school.

-- Posted by Dianatn on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 6:10 PM

Dianatn . . . my parents nor my family paid a single cent of me attending college or my expenses. I paid all four years on my own by working and loans and I even went to a private college that cost more far more than public schools like MTSU.

I am sorry . . . I see no excuses. If you desire it enough, you can make it happen!

-- Posted by jaxspike on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 6:27 PM

Also, I appreciated my education far more than those that just had it handed to them because I was paying the money for it and knew the consequences if I didn't work hard in keeping my grades up and knew it would pay for itself in the future.

-- Posted by jaxspike on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 6:29 PM

Community Service will NOT BE MANDATED on anyone unless they CHOOSE to go to college... This is also an excellent way to weed out students who don't really want to go to college but feel obligated. Scholarships and grants will still exist.

But the REAL irony is that greasemonkey and jaxspike claimed you just sit at home while Obama gives you money, yet now you're upset that he is asking you to work for it. What gives?

Face it, this idea is a great idea, and if YOU were having to choose between thousands of dollars of student loans (which could take years upon years to repay) or putting yourself to good use and volunteer throughout your community (what a concept) then you could potentially be REWARDED for HARD WORK. That is the American way. Hand outs (except for the already wealthy) should not be.

I graduate from MTSU in December and I had two major scholarships (Lottery or "HOPE" Scholarship, and MTSU Academic Service, both funded by state money) and it did not, in any way devalue my education. I respect it and maintained an above average GPA to continue receiving them. Now, as a soon to be graduate I owe absolutely NOBODY, and every student who works hard should be that lucky as well.

-- Posted by darrick_04 on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 6:32 PM

Ok someone has to clue me in. This is the first of the details I've heard.

So you're saying that if someone wants to go to college, regardless of ability to pay, they have to still perform community service? Not meant as a flame just need the clarification.

-- Posted by Tim Baker on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 8:12 PM

John Wayne (Marion Morris) once said, "Life is tough...it's even tougher if you're stupid." And, another wise saying by the old folks is, "Be careful what you ask for, you may get it."

-- Posted by elsancudo on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 8:33 PM

"From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs." Who wrote that?

-- Posted by elsancudo on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 8:35 PM

Karl Marx

-- Posted by Dianatn on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 8:50 PM

Is that who it was? Well...I'll be....

-- Posted by elsancudo on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 8:51 PM

and?

-- Posted by Dianatn on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 8:51 PM

Both of my daughters go to school one at MTSU and one at MOTLOW and work full time jobs to pay their way and they get student loans to pick up the gap, which they will pay back when they graduate. I think it should be a choice.

Now lets apply this program to the people on welfare, they get free housing, food, health care,

why should they not do so many hours a month of community work to help pay back all the money going to them.

But you know Obama won't ask them to do that.

-- Posted by bellbuckletn on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 9:44 PM

Ok someone has to clue me in. This is the first of the details I've heard.

So you're saying that if someone wants to go to college, regardless of ability to pay, they have to still perform community service? Not meant as a flame just need the clarification.

-- Posted by Tim Baker on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 8:12 PM

As I said, scholarships and grants will still exist. Student loans will still exists... This is just another avenue of alleviating the astronomical financial burden without spending ten years into your career paying back college debt. Simple concept. Work hard and reap great rewards, choose not to, nobody is going to hand you money. There has to be some sort of preventative measures and great oversight to ensure that hours of service are accurately logged and the financial award reflects hours of service. However, this, like ANY form of help can be taken advantage of.

I say, simply enough, it is a step in the right direction. Someone, somewhere has to begin with an idea, so don't be upset that it wasn't yours. Maybe they can roll this out in a test format, and if it doesn't work eliminate it. However, if we truly want to stay competitive in this new era called the global economy we have to provide opportunity (that does not mean handouts) for those who strive to succeed, actually see those dreams realized. How shameful that in the richest country on earth millions are unable to obtain a higher education because of nothing other than the financial burden... provide them incentive, get them involved in their community and reciprocate that effort with reward.

Honestly, the Academic Service Scholarship (funded through MTSU, so State Tax payer money) I received was a mirror image of Obama's proposal, so the idea is actually not revolutionary. The major difference is that I was required to work 75 hours a semester on campus (library, labs, etc) in exchange for $1500 a semester. 4 years later and a 3.5 GPA, while working 35 hours a week as well... and I owe nothing but gratitude for that.

-- Posted by darrick_04 on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 9:46 PM

Darrick,

Could you tell me more about the MTSU scholarship for academic service? My son will graduate this coming yearand I need all the info i can get on scholarships.

Thanks, you can email if you want at castle_81@msn.com. By the way you went to school with my daughter

-- Posted by For the kids on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 9:49 PM

why should they not do so many hours a month of community work to help pay back all the money going to them.

But you know Obama won't ask them to do that.

-- Posted by bellbuckletn on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 9:44 PM

And you know that how? More jobs = less welfare. Record unemployment (current situation) = more welfare.

-- Posted by darrick_04 on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 9:50 PM

Jesuslives,

I will email you for sure! Lol...and I can only imagine who your daughter is. I will try to guess in the email.

-- Posted by darrick_04 on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 9:51 PM

If they use it as an adjunct to existing programs it might work. It could be considered an option for earning essentially tuition credit. The way you described it initially, it sounded compulsory. If that's the case, it would never pass constitutional muster.

-- Posted by Tim Baker on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 10:13 PM

And you know that how? More jobs = less welfare. Record unemployment (current situation) = more welfare.

-- Posted by darrick_04 on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 9:50 PM

Where are your more jobs coming from?

I hate to tell you this but there are people on welfare not because they CAN'T work or CAN'T find a job but because they DON'T want to work and that's not going to change. And if they won't work for money they are not going to work for community service.

-- Posted by bellbuckletn on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 10:16 PM

Why would it be compulsory? If you have all the money up front to pay for your child's college then they wouldn't need any aid.

-- Posted by Dianatn on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 10:18 PM

Where are your more jobs coming from?

I hate to tell you this but there are people on welfare not because they CAN'T work or CAN'T find a job but because they DON'T want to work and that's not going to change. And if they won't work for money they are not going to work for community service.

-- Posted by bellbuckletn on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 10:16 PM

So answer my question.... 1990-2000, 2001-now? Which decade saw the welfare rolls DECREASE, and which saw them increase.... Which decade so job growth, and which saw job losses... which decade saw real wages increase, and which decade saw real wages decline?

Just trying help you understand that if you want to place blame on anyone, it would be to your detriment to get it right.

-- Posted by darrick_04 on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 10:29 PM

Jobless ranks Hit 10 Million, highest in 25 years.

http://www.t-g.com/blogshttp://www.t-g.c...

Just thought I'd share this with you bellbuckletn

Tell what you just told me to the 10,000,000 people... tell what you just told me to the GM and Ford workers who just got laid off... of the 1.2 million jobs lost this year, more than half occurred from August til October. How sad.

-- Posted by darrick_04 on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 10:37 PM

The link should have been http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081108/ap_o...

-- Posted by darrick_04 on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 10:38 PM

BTW . . I read above and its says "require 50 hours of community service in middle school and high school and 100 hours of community service in college every year."

Does not sound like a choice to me . . . usually require means you have no choice. Also, how are the middle and high school students getting paid for this?

Oh well, thank god I finished school because betwee working and studying and going to class, there was no way I would have time for this. i still find this amusing that certain people are endorsing this but yet whined about the school standard attire. What is the difference? It is a policy that is set forth to try and improve student behavior and performce.

-- Posted by jaxspike on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 11:09 PM

I hope you don't honestly think standard school attire improves student behavior or performance. Participating in community service has the potential to affect a child/teenager's character and values. Wearing a collared shirt does not.

-- Posted by LiveLaughLove on Fri, Nov 7, 2008, at 11:40 PM

It never fails, Mosely OBSESSION of reporting his negative and degrading veiws on people of color. And always reports HALF OF THE STORY. Their is nothing wrong with people doing community service, everyone benefits from it.

http://change.gov/agenda/economy/

"From Mosely":

Well, we're starting to see what kind of "change" that many of you folks voted for last week. This is from a new government website called www.change.gov, where you get to see what your new president has planned for you and your children. This isn't a wacked out conspiracy theory. It's on Obama's new website and in his new Chief of Staff's book.

I don't know about you guys, but I feel a draft…

Was this the type of "change" all of you voted for? Discuss. Change that your kids will HAVE to believe in…

It clearly SAIDS "When you choose to serve" Not "HAVE TO"

"When you choose to serve -- whether it's your nation, your community or simply your neighborhood -- you are connected to that fundamental American ideal that we want life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness not just for ourselves, but for all Americans. That's why it's called the American dream."

-- Posted by Momof3&3step&1gran on Sat, Nov 8, 2008, at 3:19 AM

LiveLaughLove,

AMEN. There is absolutely no similarity between the two. Community Service is a noble idea and it creates an attitude of service for the rest of your life... collared shirt, without stripes, and with tiny logos have absolutely no effect on the character of a person, nor does it improve their willingness to achieve.

-- Posted by stolen25 on Sat, Nov 8, 2008, at 6:16 AM

Well, it appears since bloggers discovered this idea and learned that folks objected to it, the Obama website has now been ... changed.

http://littlegreenfootballs.com/article/...

-- Posted by Brian Mosely on Sat, Nov 8, 2008, at 6:25 AM

Here's some screenshots of the change...

http://gatewaypundit.blogspot.com/2008/1...

-- Posted by Brian Mosely on Sat, Nov 8, 2008, at 6:32 AM

Just a thought...

Someone with a science major would never have time to do community service. For all you business majors, communications majors, and such let me explain.

For every one science class, you actually have two, You have another 3 hours that are lab time, almost always in the evening. Heck, I had one Chemistry class that had a 6 hour lab requirement. Anyway science majors tend to double major and then complete a science minor again with more class time required. Community service would be a burden if they work.

A college student should also not have to forfeit social clubs(fraternities or sororities) intermural sports, or professional clubs. These are way more important than Obama's 'community service'. But if they could count toward that requirement...

-- Posted by gottago on Sat, Nov 8, 2008, at 8:44 AM

My daughter is a Chemistry major and when she's not woking she's studing.

Obama can not give you all the free health care and free education and more money to the poor without raising taxes (NOTHING IS FREE IN THIS WORLD) and if he does that now it will raise the unemployment and make they's worse, so these changes will have to wait a year or a term.

But he has other changes he wants to make, all the ones he didn't tell you about before the

election.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h9x7t8dGw...

watch Obama tell a reporter from San Francisco how he will bankrupt the coal industry in fines because of the new regulations and caps he's going to put in place. He doesn't want to drill offshore for oil or use our coal, because he a clean air nut. Now I like to breath too, but doing this is going to raise gas and heating prices and how will that help any of us.

And darrick_04 I think you have done drank the cool aid, I'll pray for you it might not be to late to bring you back.

-- Posted by bellbuckletn on Sat, Nov 8, 2008, at 9:29 AM

I think some of you didn't read the paragraph thats starts The Obama Administration... It says

Obama will call on citizens of all ages to serve America. That to means EVERYONE not just our young people.

-- Posted by bellbuckletn on Sat, Nov 8, 2008, at 9:35 AM

More here.

http://www.newsbusters.org/blogs/tom-blu...

-- Posted by Brian Mosely on Sat, Nov 8, 2008, at 10:00 AM

Com'on Now, The man hasn't even took office yet and your already dogging him.

He was not my choice but I think he deserves a chance.

Just sit back and watch or at least wait to see what his plans are after January and see if they are even passed through Congress. Then if you don't like them, then feel free to gripe.

-- Posted by Dianatn on Sat, Nov 8, 2008, at 11:02 AM

the tax credit for schools is there to help people who want it. I am attending college now, my parents didn't really save for my college education. That didn't stop me from going. I have taken student loans. Whatever it takes to get there. I have worked, and I guess in some instances have been lucky to do so. Some programs don't allow time to work.. The nursing program when you get into your clinicals are 4 days a week. 8 hours a day. plus ur one day class time and study time. So working sometimes isn't an option. But the tax credit that he is making available is just to help thouse who want it. If you would rather work to pay for your own education I don't think Obama will mind. If you would like help in paying for college do 100 hours of community service and you will be rewarded $4000 a year to help pay. How can this be bad? I'm really asking because I don't understand. I would be and am grateful that he is implementing something like this to help people pay. If you don't like the idea then don't do the community service. Its not mandated.

-- Posted by outoftowner14 on Sat, Nov 8, 2008, at 11:14 AM

Create the American Opportunity Tax Credit: Obama and Biden will make college affordable for all Americans by creating a new American Opportunity Tax Credit. This universal and fully refundable credit will ensure that the first $4,000 of a college education is completely free for most Americans, and will cover two-thirds the cost of tuition at the average public college or university and make community college tuition completely free for most students. RECIPENTS of the credit will be required to conduct 100 hours of community service.

Per http://www.barackobama.com/issues/educat...

-- Posted by outoftowner14 on Sat, Nov 8, 2008, at 11:16 AM

maybe I am wrong But I feel it would be good for us all to learn what to do about these things if they happened. I read this to my 17 year old son and he said 3 months is not that bad and he would love to know were we stand and what to do if these bad things happen. Now i do not know about a draft. I do not see that coming about. But once again I may be wrong.

-- Posted by heaven8kids7grandrebelrose on Sat, Nov 8, 2008, at 11:30 AM

LiveLaughLove . . . I didn't agree with the standard school attire but the same excuse to implement is now being issued for support for this draft of students. Many said that a standard school attire would improve student behavior and increase grades(a.k.a. character and attitude) and cause less violence and bullying at school. Employers use the same explanation to implement dress attire at work . . they believe if someone dresses professional then they will act more professional and have a better self image of themself.

This community service idea is also being supported in the belief that it will improve character and attitude but the problem is that if you require it instead of making it a choice, then it seems more like a chore and not something life changing or inspiring.

So yeah, they are alike but it's just you are too stuck in political rhetoric to understand.

-- Posted by jaxspike on Sat, Nov 8, 2008, at 3:17 PM

Dianatn . . . if someone doesnt like a policy then they have the right to complain . . . its the right of every American. You have come on here many times and complain about county and city policies before they were enacted. Why are you special?

Just because someone doesn't agree with what you think or less does that make their opinion less valid?

-- Posted by jaxspike on Sat, Nov 8, 2008, at 3:20 PM

Speaking of funny, this made me laugh so hard!

http://www.theonion.com/content/video/ob...

There are some individuals on this forum who I can see in this fashion which makes it even funnier.

-- Posted by jaxspike on Sat, Nov 8, 2008, at 4:01 PM

Jaxspike

I do not consider myself special in any way. I just think it is only fair that we all give Obama a chance to prove himself. We gave Bush 8 years surely we can at least let Obama get into office before we start to criticize his programs.

I have always been and always will be an advocate for the poor and less fortunate. Regardless of how they got there. The programs outlined on Obama's website are not passed they have not even been brought before the Senate but it is one program I whole heartedly agree with..kids graduate every year from High School, kids that are smart and have worked hard only to see those scholarships go to other students who probably could have afforded the tuition anyway. Then they find out their parents just don't have the funds to send them to college. Sure they can go to work and work their way through college but good luck finding any kind of job these days much less one that will pay for tuition and living expenses. There is not one thing wrong with a child learning through community service. Maybe it will enlighten some children as to how lucky they really are when they see how others are forced to live and the normal everyday things families have to do without. In fact I think it would be good for every America to do some community service every once in a while. No matter how bad you think you have it there is always others out there that have it much worse.

Now do not mistake me as saying I agree with everything that Obama wishes in his changes, if that were a fact he would have been my candidate.

I certainly do not agree with the purposed Capital Gains tax increase I think that is quite high enough already. If I am lucky enough to sell my home and make a profit I do not feel the Government should get most of my profit.

Neither do I agree with his purposed Death Tax increase, death taxes now are outrageous and if I work my entire life to leave my children a good amount of money then they should not have to fork over half to the Government especially when I have already paid taxes on every dime I had earned.

Even though I am pro-choice I am firmly against Partial Birth Abortions and For the Infant Born Alive Act which Obama voted against 3 times.

The biggest problem I have with Obama is his immigration policies the way he has voted on immigration in the past is rather scary. By looking backwards at his record on immigration his idea of how to fix it is to make them all legal automatically...

I also want to know, what he plans on doing about No Child Left Behind. I even emailed his campaign about his plan for it but never even received a response. So I decided his plan was to do nothing. The only thing on his website about NCLB stated it was under funded ..throwing money at the NCLB policy is not going to fix the real problems behind it.

I do not agree with raising taxes on small businesses that will only cost Americans more jobs.

I feel like though any plan Obama has to help Americans become more productive will not only help Americans live a better life but will help America become a better country also.

His college policy will probably not affect me what-so-ever but I do know there are plenty of children who need something just like this.

-- Posted by Dianatn on Sat, Nov 8, 2008, at 4:16 PM

My turn at this one please...if this is some type of tax credit toward college I know my kids would jump at the chance and so would many others. If it is a requirement of everyone then the ones who are now thinking they can just sit at home and get a check aren't "going to hit a lick at a snake". What are the consequences for those folks? Any at all?

And the Kool-Aid continues to flow...

-- Posted by titanup1 on Sat, Nov 8, 2008, at 4:49 PM

From the way I read this the consequences would be you either pay for your own college education or you don't go. I did not read it as a requirement from anyone, of course, I am sure it will change many times before it is passed, if it ever passes at all.

-- Posted by Dianatn on Sat, Nov 8, 2008, at 5:48 PM

I can understand the part about getting a COLLEGE EDUCATION paid for if you do the service, but what does that have to do with requiring Middle and High school students to do the service?

-- Posted by stardust on Sun, Nov 9, 2008, at 4:22 PM

Actually, this is beginning to sound more like some of the youth programs of the United Socialist Party of Venezuela (PSUV). Not exactly like but eerily similar.

-- Posted by jaxspike on Sun, Nov 9, 2008, at 9:29 PM

Where is this money suppose to come from? It is obviously not there now so it will have to come from additional taxes.

-- Posted by KParker on Mon, Nov 10, 2008, at 12:52 AM

And yet we have somehow found the money to bail out Wall Street.

-- Posted by Dianatn on Mon, Nov 10, 2008, at 1:09 AM

I have to wonder what we as a society are supposed to reward with our treasure and our time. How should we figure out what is to be worthy of our sacrifice and legacy. Is there anything that we can, or even should do for mankind? Is it in our best interest to defer to the ideals instilled into us by the very people who have previously shown their desire to gain at our expense, or should we decide for ourselves what the objective of our existence should be?

A gentleman once told me that he could defeat any argument I could make with only 7 questions. I, being stubborn, challenged him. The question he asked repeatedly was "why?". Many times, it did not even take 7 times to end up at an introspective dead end. I realized fairly quickly that I was in fact a parasite of consciousness, that depended more on what the answer should be, than what I actually believed. I wonder what some of you good people believe to be the ultimate "why". Maybe understanding that individual reality we all live with, would make many of the subsequent arguments pointless and lead to some real understanding.

-- Posted by memyselfi on Mon, Nov 10, 2008, at 1:44 AM

Yeah dianatn . . . it is borrowed money. You can only keep borrowing for so long until your credit line is cut and they ask for it to be paid back in full and then what do we do.

What Obama fails to realize is that the people he wants to increase taxes on are the ones that save and invest and it's their investments that create more jobs. From a fiscal perspective, Obama's plan will tighten up the economy and make things worse. That doesn't mean I believe in a tax increase for everyone else, on the contrary . . . we need to make sure and not increase taxes for anyone because that will only stifle the economy even more. Unfortunately Obama want to increase government spending even more when we should be decreasing it and he feels the only way to fuel that increase in spending is to tax those who make above $250,000 but he will only create more problems with that ideology. I mean really, is a second stimulus package the answer to the problem? Bush pushed that before and what has it done? Is Obama taking a page out of a Bush policy? Also, now they are talking about a bailout for the auto industry . . . sounds like another Bush policy and that is being endorsed by Democrats greatly. All Obama is going to do is increase people's dependency on the government . . . it is that simple.

Come on people, some of this stuff is just common sense.

-- Posted by jaxspike on Mon, Nov 10, 2008, at 7:35 AM

Yes we can . . . how is it anti-American to have a different opinion than someone else? I thought this nation was based on the concept of dialogue and differences of opinions and the ability to express them.

Maybe you should pray for yourself before making such callous remarks.

-- Posted by jaxspike on Mon, Nov 10, 2008, at 7:48 AM

Yes we can . . . how is it anti-American to have a different opinion than someone else? I thought this nation was based on the concept of dialogue and differences of opinions and the ability to express them. Sounds like some of the same garbage that came out of people's mouth when labeling those that disagreed with the war in Iraq in the beginning.

Maybe you should pray for yourself before making such callous remarks.

-- Posted by jaxspike on Mon, Nov 10, 2008, at 7:50 AM

BTW . . . it seems Obama has eliminated his agenda on his website.

http://washingtontimes.com/news/2008/nov...

Also, the Federal Reserve is refusing to release information to taxpayers on who they are lending $2 trillion of money to.

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=2...

Guess who agrees in the Federal Reserves decision to not be transparent on this . . . Democrat Barney Franklin, the same person who claimed Freddie Mac Fannie Mae was doing fine when it actually wasn't. Guess who he gives advice to . . . that's right, President-elect Obama. Heck, even Paulson believes the Fed should disclose who is receiving this money and the taxpayers deserve to know since it is our money that is being given away.

-- Posted by jaxspike on Mon, Nov 10, 2008, at 11:49 AM

Jaxspike,

please email me I have something going on you may be intersted in. bumper.45acp@yahoo.com

-- Posted by greasemonkey on Mon, Nov 10, 2008, at 12:43 PM

Last week, Daniel Tillman was on the cover of our paper tutoring a fellow student. This is the community service we are talking about. This is not roadside litter pick up, this is helping a fellow human being achieve more. Our world would be a better place if more young people (and older people for that matter)cared and tried to help each other. If this is the goal of the policy in question, then there is no doubt it would have a positive effect. I know Daniel and his parents should be proud. I hope that picture is cut out and on his refrigerator with his sport pictures. This kind of caring does not occur in a vacuum, it is taught in the home.

-- Posted by gordo1965 on Mon, Nov 10, 2008, at 1:17 PM

Yes we can . . I happened to correct it but some how it didn't transfer but yet you knew who I was talking about so the error wasn't that bad. I guess you would rather point out a simple error like that than deal with real facts . . . your comment seems trivial now at best. Sorry if I made a simple human mistake. Does that make me un-American too?

I am sorry if I decide to look things up and base my beliefs on facts and information and not just hearsay.

-- Posted by jaxspike on Mon, Nov 10, 2008, at 2:41 PM

I haven't read all the entries...but there is nothing wrong with community service. Many successful high schools require their seniors to undertake community service projects or to perform hours of service in a project already established. This isn't meant to be punishment. It is used to foster an atmosphere of ownership in one's community.

I have sponsored Key Club in middle school and those kids really stepped up when called upon. When a tornado hit Gallatin, those kids collected enough food and clothing to fill up an enclosed pick-up truck in TWO DAYS. That's great community spirit. I sponsor a recycling effort now and I have several kids who single-handedly collect paper and plastic bottles to help reduce landfill space.

Nothing wrong with that kind of work.

-- Posted by Jacks4me on Mon, Nov 10, 2008, at 2:46 PM

Speaking of funny, this made me laugh so hard!

http://www.theonion.com/content/video/ob...

There are some individuals on this forum who I can see in this fashion which makes it even funnier.

-- Posted by jaxspike on Sat, Nov 8, 2008, at 4:01 PM

Now that was a pretty funny one jaxpike.

-- Posted by parkerbrothers on Mon, Nov 10, 2008, at 3:03 PM

Our country is still about freedom no matter what your age might be.

Community service should be a choice, not a requirement. Many teenagers do already serve their community through many organizations-but they do not have the govt stepping in to make sure they do.

This is still a FREE country; at least for now.

-- Posted by stardust on Mon, Nov 10, 2008, at 3:17 PM

This seems a lot like a program that was set up in a European country several years back. The children of this country were asked by the leader of this country to take part in community service. They helped during times of peace and times of war. they were led by a man who had high hopes for both his country and his people. he inspired with his words as well as his actions, he brought his country out of the depression into a time of great prosperity, He then used the youth as a last line of defense against the allies as they entered Berlin. If you haven't guest by now I speak of the Hitler Youth. This reeks of socialism.

-- Posted by docudrama on Tue, Nov 11, 2008, at 3:57 AM

Call it what you will...Many high schools and colleges already require community service as graduation requirements.

-- Posted by Jacks4me on Tue, Nov 11, 2008, at 7:19 AM

docudrama . . . Obama has actually called for a domestic civil defense corp that would be just as powerful as the current military and that would answer to him. I dont know how he would afford it with all his other policies and the fact he now wants to bailout the auto industry.

-- Posted by jaxspike on Tue, Nov 11, 2008, at 8:10 AM

Jacks4me . . . did you do your community service out of choice or requirement? There is a difference and that is what people are upset about . . . not about the community service part. It should be a choice . . . people should have freedom to choose such things. If you want to slowly give your freedom of choice away then so be it but I sure don't.

-- Posted by jaxspike on Tue, Nov 11, 2008, at 8:13 AM

Where I am it is a choice for now. There is a high school initiative called "High Schools That Work" that is a movement to gear students in a specific direction (college, tech school, employment right out of HS). See http://www.sreb.org/programs/hstw/hstwin...

For more information. Schools spend several years working to be a HSTW site. It works. Anyway, getting to the point, part of the initiative requires a Senior Project of which some type of community service is required.

I don't see anything wrong with making it a requirement. A community uses its taxes gained from adults to provide an education. Why not ask/require the students to give back? It makes for a better mindset than they are "owed" an education. Planning for projects, using management skills, working towards a specific goal are all skills that young people need to succeed. We aren't asking them to do hard labor. We are asking them what they can do to make their community a better place. I think the connotation "community service" places the insinuation that this is a type punishment, which is misleading.

-- Posted by Jacks4me on Tue, Nov 11, 2008, at 9:06 AM

Please tell me why the federal government should be dictating such policy? If it's community service, then the local community should choose such matters. When you have government start such policies, then it stretches out past that and continues to grow from its original concept. I still believe that community service is something that is gained more from choice than being forced to do. If people were forced to go to church, would their faith be the same if they had chosen to go instead. I doubt it . . . if someone wants to do community service to pay for college then that is great but it should be a choice and not a requirement. We already have such programs in existence like the National Guard.

-- Posted by jaxspike on Tue, Nov 11, 2008, at 9:23 AM

I guess the American people are tired of thinking and doing for themselves, and they think its time to let the govt do it for them.

-- Posted by greasemonkey on Tue, Nov 11, 2008, at 9:53 AM

In the broad scope of things, isn't requiring an education a government mandate forced upon us. By your reasoning, isn't forcing kids to go to school wrong because they aren't choosing to get an education? It's all in the name of improving community we want children to be educated. How far would we get if anyone who didn't want to be educated was allowed to sit back and do whatever they wanted at the expense of everyone else?

Isn't it a goal of education to turn out productive citizens?

-- Posted by Jacks4me on Tue, Nov 11, 2008, at 11:37 AM

Did anyone read that the Good Sam cupboard is almost empty? How about a community service project to restock it? With Sanford closing, it's about to get called upon more often.

-- Posted by Jacks4me on Tue, Nov 11, 2008, at 12:00 PM

Community service is not all that bad but to force someone to do it teaches them nothing. i have several children and they have been involved in doing community service since 4th grade through a local community club. what about all the hours they have donated????? they won't count for anything. one of my children is in college and have been for several years she works and goes to school and when is she suppose to take time to do community service? she has to study when she is not in class or working cause getting good grades do not come easy for her. she works just so she can afford college.

i never attended college i went right in to the military out of high school. i have always thought everyone in the country should spend at least one hitch in the military just so you can learn what it takes to keep our freedoms. i attended a veteran's day activity at my youngest school today and i felt so out of place. i was the only female veteran and i did not serve during a conflict of any kind and my male counterparts that were present i served during peace time but i am proud that i served.

i think that if you draw any government assistance of any kind then you should be required to put in alot of community service hours. now that would be a good ideal......

-- Posted by dragonfly on Tue, Nov 11, 2008, at 1:24 PM

I think that is a great idea Jacks4me maybe we could get the churches to sponser something like this.

Do you know where the food goes that the Postal Service picks up every year? I have often wondered if that food stays within the communtiy or if it goes out to other places?

-- Posted by Dianatn on Tue, Nov 11, 2008, at 1:33 PM

I don't know where Good Sam is and I don't attend church...but if a church or business in town could offer to be a drop off point that would be great. I saw Girl Scouts at Wal-Mart last weekend taking up donations of food, where did that go?

-- Posted by Jacks4me on Tue, Nov 11, 2008, at 2:10 PM

Dragonfly...I too think that those on government assistance should absolutely have to put in community service time.

-- Posted by Jacks4me on Tue, Nov 11, 2008, at 2:13 PM

Over the past eight years, I have heard a lot of conservatives refer to people like me as unpatriotic. Usually because I didn't agree with conservative policies. My conservative neighbors have touted that it is every americans responsibility to support and follow the commander in cheif.

Now, as expected. I hear you, referring to our President elect as a Nazi. You should be ashamed.

This is supposedly a democratic country. In my mind that means that the minority accepts the decisons of the majority.

President elect Obama was elected fairly and within the rules of our land. Accept it, support him and this country. In other words quit being a hypocrite.

-- Posted by goose2008 on Tue, Nov 11, 2008, at 5:18 PM

I saw Girl Scouts at Wal-Mart last weekend taking up donations of food, where did that go?

-- Posted by Jacks4me on Tue, Nov 11, 2008, at 2:10 PM

I dunno? I don't know anybody that is still in Girl Scouts to ask either.:>(

-- Posted by Dianatn on Tue, Nov 11, 2008, at 6:42 PM

I think the idea that if you receive Gov. Assistance, YOU should be required to participate in some type of community service, is a fantastic one. Food stamps, housing, welfare, all should be included, if you use it then the tax payers that provide it should receive a service for it. While doing community service who knows a skill may be learned to enable these people to get of the government assistance rolls, and become tax paying citizens.

-- Posted by docudrama on Tue, Nov 11, 2008, at 8:01 PM

goose2008, you are very wrong, No where in the segment did I refer to Obama as a Nazi. I stated that this program of requiring the youth of the nation to do community service by mandate is reminiscent of the program forced upon the youth of Germany before WWII. I don't think that Obama is a Nazi, and as a citizen of this nation I will respect the office of president and the man who sits there. However, again as an American I feel that it is my right, as such, to disagree with and to voice my opinion on policies that are or may be enacted by my government. And if I may add that even as a conservative I have had issue with a lot of the things that George Bush has done while in office, so how dare you refer to me as a hypocrite, when you have no idea what I stand for. This is very typical of liberals that when they don't have all the facts they resort to name calling.

-- Posted by docudrama on Tue, Nov 11, 2008, at 8:17 PM

Sort of like the word "liberal"... or is that not name calling? "Very typical" of, indicates a stereotype, so move on.

-- Posted by stolen25 on Tue, Nov 11, 2008, at 9:08 PM

stolen25, when someone accuses me of an act I did not perpetrate such as goose2008. I don't go quietly into that good night. I speak my mind. If goose2008 wishes to make the statement that was made, which took a very liberal tone, then I call it as it reads. As for "move on" I fail to see your point. This subject matter, the mandatory community service, deserves more than name calling. If Obama, wishes to have a civil defense that answers only to the president, then every person in this country should look very hard and deep into the under lying motive of such a mandate. Move on!!

-- Posted by docudrama on Tue, Nov 11, 2008, at 9:39 PM

I think the idea that if you receive Gov. Assistance, YOU should be required to participate in some type of community service, is a fantastic one. Food stamps, housing, welfare, all should be included, if you use it then the tax payers that provide it should receive a service for it. While doing community service who knows a skill may be learned to enable these people to get of the government assistance rolls, and become tax paying citizens.

-- Posted by docudrama on Tue, Nov 11, 2008, at 8:01 PM

Well said.

-- Posted by parkerbrothers on Wed, Nov 12, 2008, at 7:41 AM

You know what I find amazing The Tennessee Report Cards for meeting their AYP Benchmarks came out on Monday. Every High School in Bedford County is now a Target School and not one article in the newspaper about this I kept waiting thinking surely there would be something.

So just to let you all know Cascade and Community High Schools did not meet their AYP Benchmarks they are now a Target School.

Eastside, Southside and Eakin met their AYP but consider the fact they are all just K-3.

Community elementary did not meet their AYP neither did Thomas.

Cascade and Liberty are the only full K-8 schools that met their AYP in the entire county.

Hats off to you Cascade and Liberty!!!!

http://edu.reportcard.state.tn.us/pls/ap...

-- Posted by Dianatn on Wed, Nov 12, 2008, at 11:39 AM

More concern about traffic cameras than school performance. (Although I will have to reiterate that judging schools on a multiple choice test given once a year is not fair.)

-- Posted by Jacks4me on Wed, Nov 12, 2008, at 12:40 PM

I agree I am not an fan of Standardized Testing but that is what NCLB is all about..and the t-g sure made a big deal out of Central High School and Harris not making their benchmarks earlier this year but not one word about any of the others.

-- Posted by Dianatn on Wed, Nov 12, 2008, at 1:31 PM

You know what I find amazing The Tennessee Report Cards for meeting their AYP Benchmarks came out on Monday. Every High School in Bedford County is now a Target School and not one article in the newspaper about this I kept waiting thinking surely there would be something.

So just to let you all know Cascade and Community High Schools did not meet their AYP Benchmarks they are now a Target School.

Eastside, Southside and Eakin met their AYP but consider the fact they are all just K-3.

Community elementary did not meet their AYP neither did Thomas.

Cascade and Liberty are the only full K-8 schools that met their AYP in the entire county.

Hats off to you Cascade and Liberty!!!!

http://edu.reportcard.state.tn.us/pls/ap...

-- Posted by Dianatn on Wed, Nov 12, 2008, at 11:39 AM

I will repost it for you since the Times Gazette forget to!

-- Posted by darrick_04 on Wed, Nov 12, 2008, at 2:44 PM

https://tvaas.sas.com/evaas/welcome.jsp

Here's the site to view your school's scores and three year averages.

-- Posted by Jacks4me on Wed, Nov 12, 2008, at 3:05 PM

Not to worry. Implementation of standardized attire will get all those scores back up.[sarcasm]

-- Posted by stardust on Wed, Nov 12, 2008, at 5:19 PM

There was a post on another thread that they would rather get it(story about test scores) right than to put it out early. Said it was "complicated". Excuse me? These are the same reports that come out every year. Are some of the writers at the TG so slow it takes them 2 days to understand the report? Go find a teacher, they can translate all of it in about 2 minutes for you.

-- Posted by Jacks4me on Thu, Nov 13, 2008, at 7:17 AM

Another tid-bit of info Central High School will be featured on Channel 4 Cool Schools Friday Morning if anyone is interested.

http://www.wsmv.com/education/14063309/d...

-- Posted by Dianatn on Thu, Nov 13, 2008, at 11:26 AM

Hats off to you Cascade and Liberty!!!!

http://edu.reportcard.state.tn.us/pls/ap...

-- Posted by Dianatn on Wed, Nov 12, 2008, at 11:39 AM

No, hats off to you Dianatn for such a sarcastic remark. Instead of taking satisfaction from a problem that is prevalent in most all communities through-out the nation. You should use your wit and intelligence to help bring the scores of the schools in your community up to meet national standards, instead of using it to make sarcastic and petty remarks.

-- Posted by docudrama on Thu, Nov 13, 2008, at 4:50 PM

No, hats off to you Dianatn for such a sarcastic remark. Instead of taking satisfaction from a problem that is prevalent in most all communities through-out the nation. You should use your wit and intelligence to help bring the scores of the schools in your community up to meet national standards, instead of using it to make sarcastic and petty remarks.

-- Posted by docudrama on Thu, Nov 13, 2008, at 4:50

Please know what you are talking about before you speak.

Hats off to you....is a compliment!!!

There was nothing sarcastic about my remark in regards to Liberty or Cascade.

Maybe just a little sarcastic towards to t-g for not reporting that they were among the schools who actually met their benchmarks.

-- Posted by Dianatn on Thu, Nov 13, 2008, at 5:00 PM

I guess it takes two full days for the writers AND the board to dig out enough positive numbers to make a headline like that? While I do appreciate the positive aspects of a news story, I have to question the way the story was written. I also have to doubt the assertion that so many of Tennessee's counties have less than half of its schools in good standing, but I will do the research and find out.

-- Posted by memyselfi on Thu, Nov 13, 2008, at 5:18 PM

I am truly sorry, Dianatn I beg your pardon. I miss-read the entry. I hope you will except my apology.

-- Posted by docudrama on Thu, Nov 13, 2008, at 11:59 PM

docudrama

No problem, we all read things wrong sometimes.

-- Posted by Dianatn on Fri, Nov 14, 2008, at 4:57 AM

For those of you who didn't get up at 4am to watch Central High School on Cools Schools last friday morning here's a small clip from the Cool Schools website.

It does give you a peek inside the new addition.

http://www.wsmv.com/video/17964118/index...

-- Posted by Dianatn on Thu, Nov 20, 2008, at 2:24 PM


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