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Fact ,Faith or FictionPosted Saturday, July 12, 2008, at 12:42 PM
It seems like everybody wants facts and don't care about faith, sad world we live in.
In todays courts system you can be found taken to trial on the eyewitness accounts of one or two people and found guilty by a jury of 12,small numbers to me compared to the eyewitness accounts of Jesus Christ I will list as these are the ones AFTER the resurrection. First appearance to Mary of Magdalene- John 20 :11-17 Second appearance to other women-Matt 28:9-10 Third :to Peter Luke24:34 1Cor.15:5 Fourth- to the disciples on the road to Emmaus- Mark 16:12-13 Luke2;24-13-31 Fifth - to the ten disciples- Mark 16-14 Sixth-to the 11 disciples a week after the resurrection John- 20:26-29 Seventh- to seven disciples at the Sea of Galilee John-21:1-23 Eight- appearance to 500 1 Cor.:15-6 Ninth- appearance to Lord's brother James 1Cor. 15:7 Tenth -to eleven disciples on the mountain in Galilee Matt.28 1-20 Eleventh- the time of the ascension Luke 24;44-53 Acts-7:55-56 Twelfth- appearance to Stephen just before Stephen's death Acts7:55-56 Thirteenth- to Paul on the road to Damascus Acts9:3-6 22:6-11, 26:13-18 Fourteenth To Paul in Arabia Gal.1:12-17 Fifteenth- to Paul in the temple A cts9;26-27 22:17-21 Sixteenth- To Paul while in prison in Caesarea Acts23:11 Seventeenth- to the apostle John Rev 1:12-20 I don't know about you but if all these eyewitnesses were to go to even the most liberal of courts today I think even today's sorry excuse for judges could not detract and prove Jesus a myth. Even as some say that Jesus did not fulfill prophecy even if he only fulfilled that is enough for me. No other religious icon died for his followers. As far as last days go YES! I believe that we are either entering in or already in those days. The bible speaks of the following 24:6 And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all [these things] must come to pass, but the end is not yet. 24:7 For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places. Matthew 24:6-7 KJV 3:1 This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come. 3:2 For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, 2 Timothy 3:1-2 KJV 3:14 And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God; 3:15 I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot. 3:16 So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth. 3:17 Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked: 3:18 I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and [that] the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see. 3:19 As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent. Revelation 3:14-19 KJV 4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; 4:4 And they shall turn away [their] ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables. 2 Timothy 4:3-4 KJV 1:17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith. 1:18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness; 1:19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed [it] unto them. 1:20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, [even] his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse: 1:21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified [him] not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. 1:22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools, 1:23 And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things. 1:24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves: 1:25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen. 1:26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: 1:27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet. 1:28 And even as they did not like to retain God in [their] knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient; 1:29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers, 1:30 Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, 1:31 Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful: 1:32 Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them. Romans 1:17-32 KJV 3:3 Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good, 2 Timothy 3:3 KJV 9:21 Neither repented they of their murders, nor of their sorceries, nor of their fornication, nor of their thefts. Revelation 9:21 KJV 2:1 Why do the heathen rage, and the people imagine a vain thing? 2:2 The kings of the earth set themselves, and the rulers take counsel together, against the LORD, and against his anointed, [saying], 2:3 Let us break their bands asunder, and cast away their cords from us. Psalms 2:1-3 KJV 24:32 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer [is] nigh: 24:33 So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, [even] at the doors. 24:34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled. Matthew 24:32-34 KJV 13:4 And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who [is] like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him? 13:5 And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty [and] two months. 13:6 And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven. 13:7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations. 13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world. Revelation 13:4-8 KJV 17:1 And there came one of the seven angels which had the seven vials, and talked with me, saying unto me, Come hither; I will shew unto thee the judgment of the great whore that sitteth upon many waters: 17:2 With whom the kings of the earth have committed fornication, and the inhabitants of the earth have been made drunk with the wine of her fornication. 17:3 So he carried me away in the spirit into the wilderness: and I saw a woman sit upon a scarlet coloured beast, full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns. 17:4 And the woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet colour, and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls, having a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication: 17:5 And upon her forehead [was] a name written, MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH. 17:6 And I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus: and when I saw her, I wondered with great admiration. 17:7 And the angel said unto me, Wherefore didst thou marvel? I will tell thee the mystery of the woman, and of the beast that carrieth her, which hath the seven heads and ten horns. 17:8 The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is. 17:9 And here [is] the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth. 17:10 And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, [and] the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space. 17:11 And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition. 17:12 And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast. 17:13 These have one mind, and shall give their power and strength unto the beast. 17:14 These shall make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb shall overcome them: for he is Lord of lords, and King of kings: and they that are with him [are] called, and chosen, and faithful. 17:15 And he saith unto me, The waters which thou sawest, where the whore sitteth, are peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues. 17:16 And the ten horns which thou sawest upon the beast, these shall hate the whore, and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall eat her flesh, and burn her with fire. 17:17 For God hath put in their hearts to fulfil his will, and to agree, and give their kingdom unto the beast, until the words of God shall be fulfilled. 17:18 And the woman which thou sawest is that great city, which reigneth over the kings of the earth. Revelation 17:1-18 KJV 18:1 And after these things I saw another angel come down from heaven, having great power; and the earth was lightened with his glory. 18:2 And he cried mightily with a strong voice, saying, Babylon the great is fallen, is fallen, and is become the habitation of devils, and the hold of every foul spirit, and a cage of every unclean and hateful bird. 18:3 For all nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her fornication, and the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth are waxed rich through the abundance of her delicacies. 18:4 And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues. 18:5 For her sins have reached unto heaven, and God hath remembered her iniquities. 18:6 Reward her even as she rewarded you, and double unto her double according to her works: in the cup which she hath filled fill to her double. 18:7 How much she hath glorified herself, and lived deliciously, so much torment and sorrow give her: for she saith in her heart, I sit a queen, and am no widow, and shall see no sorrow. 18:8 Therefore shall her plagues come in one day, death, and mourning, and famine; and she shall be utterly burned with fire: for strong [is] the Lord God who judgeth her. 18:9 And the kings of the earth, who have committed fornication and lived deliciously with her, shall bewail her, and lament for her, when they shall see the smoke of her burning, 18:10 Standing afar off for the fear of her torment, saying, Alas, alas, that great city Babylon, that mighty city! for in one hour is thy judgment come. 18:11 And the merchants of the earth shall weep and mourn over her; for no man buyeth their merchandise any more: 18:12 The merchandise of gold, and silver, and precious stones, and of pearls, and fine linen, and purple, and silk, and scarlet, and all thyine wood, and all manner vessels of ivory, and all manner vessels of most precious wood, and of brass, and iron, and marble, 18:13 And cinnamon, and odours, and ointments, and frankincense, and wine, and oil, and fine flour, and wheat, and beasts, and sheep, and horses, and chariots, and slaves, and souls of men. 18:14 And the fruits that thy soul lusted after are departed from thee, and all things which were dainty and goodly are departed from thee, and thou shalt find them no more at all. 18:15 The merchants of these things, which were made rich by her, shall stand afar off for the fear of her torment, weeping and wailing, 18:16 And saying, Alas, alas, that great city, that was clothed in fine linen, and purple, and scarlet, and decked with gold, and precious stones, and pearls! 18:17 For in one hour so great riches is come to nought. And every shipmaster, and all the company in ships, and sailors, and as many as trade by sea, stood afar off, 18:18 And cried when they saw the smoke of her burning, saying, What [city is] like unto this great city! 18:19 And they cast dust on their heads, and cried, weeping and wailing, saying, Alas, alas, that great city, wherein were made rich all that had ships in the sea by reason of her costliness! for in one hour is she made desolate. 18:20 Rejoice over her, [thou] heaven, and [ye] holy apostles and prophets; for God hath avenged you on her. 18:21 And a mighty angel took up a stone like a great millstone, and cast [it] into the sea, saying, Thus with violence shall that great city Babylon be thrown down, and shall be found no more at all. 18:22 And the voice of harpers, and musicians, and of pipers, and trumpeters, shall be heard no more at all in thee; and no craftsman, of whatsoever craft [he be], shall be found any more in thee; and the sound of a millstone shall be heard no more at all in thee; 18:23 And the light of a candle shall shine no more at all in thee; and the voice of the bridegroom and of the bride shall be heard no more at all in thee: for thy merchants were the great men of the earth; for by thy sorceries were all nations deceived. 18:24 And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth. Revelation 18:1-24 KJV I could go on with more but my point is , it is here. I am not trying to sway your beliefs , just stating fact. You don't have all the time you think you do. All you need to do is to come to Christ to put your Faith in him and what he did on the cross. The FACT is you will be saved! All the rest will learn that what they thought to be a FICTION book was and is indeed the Walking Talking inerrant Word of God! Comments Showing comments in chronological order [Show most recent comments first] |
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What is the church that you belong to-like the name
I belong to Lighthouse church right now till God blesses me with my own.
These blogs are mine and do not reflect all the views of Lighthouse or what is taught there.
http://www.t-g.com/blogs/michaelbell/ent...
Sound familiar? Same crap. different day.
Sound familiar? Same crap. different day.
-- Posted by nascarfanatic on Sat, Jul 12, 2008, at 6:08 PM
Sound familiar? Same nascarfanatic fumes, different day.
Awe look, it's the guy who almost killed someone... How have you been?
Parker
AS I told you before just let it be SFGTD .
Oh Nascar ,Monkey,in case you haven't figured it out by now "Something For God To Do."
WGAS?
Looks like a monkey does?
http://www.jeffpidgeon.com/uploaded_imag...
Parkerbrothers, since you are such a supporter of Mr. Bell, why don't you fund his church? Why does it bother you what nascar or Em even says. If your are such a devout Christian then you do not need to belittle yourself trying to come up with some pitiful comeback?
While I can agree with some things Michael says, he does contradict himself alot. And you sir , just try to pick someones comments apart. You constantly have to question what someone posts except Michael. If Michael thinks something is bad then it must be right....
Mr. Bell you stated these are your beliefs and do not reflect on your church. Well if these are not the beliefs of the church you attend, then why are you going. I have been to your church, and I have seen the way have treated some. It was very sad. I do know that this may not been everyone there, but for me I have a problem with someone being so judgemental when he preaches alot about how he treated his family before God saved him.
And Pb before you so thoughtfully get on here and pick apart everything I wrote just know your big words or sarcasm mean nothing to me. I will still pray for you because you are God's child and hope you will start showing positive things god does in your life.
For people who claim to be christians, their actions and words speak otherwise. Sometimes I feel like I am reading an argument between children.
So much judgment is being passed on here when in reality we all need to quit judging others and look at our own sins and mistakes and work on making ourselves a better person. When we do that, then we shine as Christians and people will see that and will be inspired to do the same. However, when you cast stones at people for being less than what you are when you are a sinner yourself, you only turn away people who truly need to see the light.
jaxspike,
Well said. How are things going?
michaelbell,
Great post. Someone sent me the link below and I thought it would fit in somewhat with your topic.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uZIfyXc8R...
jesuslives,
You posted nothing to pick apart nor discern. Just a little chitter chatter like the rest of us.
What do you think about the actual topic though on a more serious note??
jesse sellers,
I have gotten use to those two some time ago. I actually have come to expect certain spirits to growl everytime the word of God is discussed in any manner. It just has that effect on some. Especially with these type post that remind them time is short. They know we are one day closer than yesterday. Tick Tock...Tick Tock...
I have given my life over to the Lord and live for him every day whether he comes tomorrow or years after I am gone. I think it is arrogent of some to think they know we are in the end of times. But then again people have been doing it for years. There has always been wars, famines, disasters and people who live their lives in shameful ways. They can take prayer out of schools, but if I have taught my children correctly they will still pray. I do not need a teacher to lead them in prayer, They can remove the ten commandments from public places but as long as I live by them and teach my children to live by them they still carry on. If we live by what we learn from the bible then we do not have to have it posted. They cannot take away these things because it is how we live and how we let God's love show in our lives. If we do not live by them what is it going to matter if they are posted on some wall. Some like the hell and damnation sermons. Personally, I do not believe in scaring people to Jesus. Hell is a reality, but so is heaven. If Jesus comes back tomorrow, I am ready.
I agree with you jaxspike. I would only ask jesuslives why do you single out parkerbrothers. nascarfanatic fired the first shot.
Sound familiar? Same crap. different day.
-- Posted by nascarfanatic on Sat, Jul 12, 2008, at 6:08 PM
Did nascar actually call out PB? NO! He just posted what he thought this blog was? That is his opinion. PB decided to call him out on a personal issue. We all get on here and post to what we believe or do not, but as Christians I do not think we should be sinking to a childish level of who can put who down more. What kind of example is that?
jesuslives,
You and I may be ready and that is good and well, but what do you think about you and I caring about someone besides you and I? Love is not about you and I being ready. Love is about someone other than you and I. Jesus himself was ready all along but He still had the Passion. That is also the cross he mentioned when He said "If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow me."
I personally do not see anything Michael post as intended to necessarily scare anybody as its' primary goal. I do recognize that the reality of what he says may cause a degree of scare in certain people but I think it could be a healthy scare that might serve well. Better for a child to be a little scared of the pit bull in someone's yard than to be sorry from a lack of fear. Fear is part of a complete healthy person just as joy is.
I choose not to condemn but instead commend Michael for picking up the cross and trying to carry it for the benefit of someone other than himself. I have yet to see him gain anything except more riddiculing from all angles from ones carrying no cross. Ridicule the messenger and you have ridiculed the message.
Did nascar actually call out PB? NO! He just posted what he thought this blog was? That is his opinion. PB decided to call him out on a personal issue. We all get on here and post to what we believe or do not, but as Christians I do not think we should be sinking to a childish level of who can put who down more. What kind of example is that?
-- Posted by jesuslives on Sun, Jul 13, 2008, at 10:10 AM
jesuslives,
I simply stated what I thought about nascarfanatics post which is my opinion. Much like you did when you posted what you thought about my post??? Are you and nascarfanatic entitled to any special priviledges that I am unaware of on here?
For people who claim to be christians, their actions and words speak otherwise. Sometimes I feel like I am reading an argument between children.
So much judgment is being passed on here when in reality we all need to quit judging others and look at our own sins and mistakes and work on making ourselves a better person. When we do that, then we shine as Christians and people will see that and will be inspired to do the same. However, when you cast stones at people for being less than what you are when you are a sinner yourself, you only turn away people who truly need to see the light.
-- Posted by jaxspike on Sat, Jul 12, 2008, at 10:40 PM
jaxspike,
What is this wrongful "passing judgement" you talk of? I am interested in hearing more about this. Teach me about it.
You know parkerbrothers, if I have to explain your actions and the actions of others then you are far more in denial than one can imagine.
From what I hear, you are one that definitely does not need to pass any judgment on here or in life in general. Worry about your own sins and God will worry about the sins of others as it should be. I might not agree with what people may do or how they live their life but it is not my place or yours to determine if they are going to hell or not, that is God's and God's alone. Your job as a christian should be to live in the word of God and Jesus and in doing so will draw people in by example. In that regards, we should treat all people with respect and love and not turn them away but that doesnt mean you have to condone what they do or how they live their life. No one is perfect . . . do you claim to be which allows you to judge others and their sins?
I dont think that idea needs any explaining.
You know, Michael's blogs aren't about religion anymore. It is now the Cult of Personalities. Nothing ever changes, nothing new. Same thing, and I am to blame for some of it. But when I feel something is wrong I tend to stand against it. So If we don't comment on it, I think it will die out because we are all he has. So if we stop responding, he will fade away.
PB, I did not say I was entitled to put any one down nor did I try. You speak of loving others besides ourselves, Well where is the LOVE when you come back with some snotty comment because you do not like what someone posted? I do believe actions speak louder than words. Anyone can say they are a Christian but I am going to be drawn to those who live their lives by the word. Like I said before also I know there is Hell but I like a the other type a preaching. I never said that type of message was wrong but that I prefer different.
Also I did not even post anything remotely ugly to you, but stated the obvious. Now lets see if you will answer the question asked. If you are such a devout Christian why do you feel the need to belittle yourself to come up with some comeback to someone whos opinion of you should not matter. You should be only interested in God's opinion of your actions.
Evil Monkey- I ain't going nowhere nor will I quit doing what I do , with or without comments.
Like when I have my church if I have 1 or a 101 there I will still do what God has called me to do.
Feel free to stay or leave that is your preference.
I will still be here doing what I do.
I am not judging for the judge passes sentence I just say what the bible says and leave it at that.
The bible judges not me.
jaxspike,
You did not understand what was asked. Let me try again. Tell me what it means to "judge" someone and give me an example of when I have done it (judging) according to you.
jesuslives,
Your entire post was almost nothing but a put down of me, Michael and the church he attends. Read it again.
But when I feel something is wrong I tend to stand against it.
-- Posted by Evil Monkey on Sun, Jul 13, 2008, at 12:21 PM
Now tells us what you believe and stand for?
I believe we have been on the doorstep of the last days ever since the ascension. How great a period of time this covers only God knows. I personally am more concerned about the new days available to us when we grasp the love of Jesus and let him change us. Some people respond to the promise of new days but I also believe some respond to the threat of last days. Only the Holy Spirit can guide us in knowing which message to use when spreading the gospel. I suspect the message of love is much more powerful.
This is the Lords Day. The sermon today was "Not ashame of the Gospel" I believe in God the Father, the Son and The Holy Spirit. And what I learn and have been taught from was the Holy Bible. KJV. I have been through good and bad times, and was taught to fear God at a young age. God is very real to me, not fiction. Their are false prophets out their and other books out their that may stear people wrong. When God touches your life, you think and act different to situations you would have acted to before that. Am I without sin? No I do sin, that is my earthly weakness. But my spirit, and my heart prays to God for strength and forgiveness. I still have alot to learn in life, but with God on my side I can not fail. I live my life on faith in Jesus Christ who died and rose again so that I may live an eternal life in Heaven and not Hell.
devan,
In your opinion what did Jesus as Savior come to save us from in reference to your comment? The "last days" or the "new days" you mentioned?
Momof3&3step&1gran,
No one could have said that any better than what you just did. It was great.
The world is being deceived by the Long haired Jesus.
Revelations:12-9 says that Satan has deceive the
whole world.
The fact is, the "Jesus" prominently displayed today in most churches of so called Christendom is not the Jesus of the Bible, either in His flesh state on earth or His divine state in heaven. The real Jesus of the New Testament groomed Himself by clipping His hair short. The reason for knowing this is clear. The apostle Paul said it was a shame for a man to have long hair.(ICor.11:3-16) Long feminine type hair on a man is how evil spirits are portrayed in the book of Revelation. (Revelation 9:7-8)
Notice what John stayed in John 4:1
Beloved, believed not every spirit, but try the spirits[put the spirits and their teachings to test] whether they are of God: BECAUSE MANY [not the few, but many] FALSE PROPHETS ARE GONE OUT INTO THE WORLD.
The apostle Paul warned people in no certain manner to be aware of their tactics because these false apostles and false prophets normally look good and righteous on the surface. As a matter of a fact, Satan himself appears as an a angle of light.
Notice what Paul stated in 2 Corinthians 11:13-15
"For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ. And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into a angle of light. Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their work.
This section of Scripture tells us very much. It shows that false teachers are normally those who look righteous and good on the surface. They even appear as "Ministers of Righteous" by teaching messages that are socially and religiously acceptable to most ordinary people in society. Remember that Christ himself also taught that at the end of the age, many people would arise who would be saying that Christ was indeed the Messiah of the world, but even though they did this, they would be "Great Deceivers." Note what Christ told his apostles in Matthew 24:4-5.
"and Jesus answered and said unto them. Take heed that no man deceive you. For many shall come in my name, saying[or admitting],I am the Christ; and shall deceive many."
Christ Jesus went further than that in warning us about these people who state they are followers of Christ and claim to be advocating the basic principles of Christianity. Note what Christ said in Matthew 7:21-23.
"Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the Kingdom of Heaven; but he that doth the will of my Farther which is in heaven. Many [again note that Christ said"MANY"] will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? And in thy name have cast out devils? And thy name done many wonderful works? And then will profess unto them, I never knew you: Depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
We should notice that Christ predicted that "MANY" would even "PROPHESY" in His name with many wonderful signs and works, but they would still be considered by Christ to be iniquitous "PROPHETS".
Remember, believe not ever spirit, but try the spirits to see if they are of God.
What put you down? And as far as the church goes, i believe when you step into a church it should be welcoming and the least of all judgemental. I spoke of my particular experience not everyones. Oh and by the way YOU still have not answered my question.
devan,
In your opinion what did Jesus as Savior come to save us from in reference to your comment? The "last days" or the "new days" you mentioned?
-- Posted by parkerbrothers on Sun, Jul 13, 2008, at 3:07 PM
He came to save us from the last days by giving us new days if we accept them (him). Then we don't have to worry about the last days.
Probably too short a response to be a theology but its a good start :).
I've learned that the greater a person's sense of guilt, the greater his or her need to cast blame on others.
What put you down? And as far as the church goes, i believe when you step into a church it should be welcoming and the least of all judgemental. I spoke of my particular experience not everyones. Oh and by the way YOU still have not answered my question.
-- Posted by jesuslives on Sun, Jul 13, 2008, at 3:37 PM
jesuslives,
Just read your post again. It was your opinion just like mine was my own of which I posted.
Your Question:
"Now lets see if you will answer the question asked. If you are such a devout Christian why do you feel the need to belittle yourself to come up with some comeback to someone whos opinion of you should not matter."
My Answer:
My comeback was not in response to someones opinion of me. It was in response to someone opinion of the blog topic as being crap. The subject of seventeen different eyewitnesses of a resurrected Christ is not crap in my opinion. An opinion which by the way I am entitled to have just as you can have yours.
Now let's see if you can answer a couple of questions. Do you as a Christian think the topic of the blog is crap? Does it bother you as a Christian to see someone call references from the Bible crap?
He came to save us from the last days by giving us new days if we accept them (him). Then we don't have to worry about the last days.
Probably too short a response to be a theology but its a good start :).
-- Posted by devan on Sun, Jul 13, 2008, at 3:54 PM
devan,
While everything you said is true, I have to say that we are not guaranteed any new day(s) here by accepting Him. He does however save us from the wrath and anger to come poured out on unrepentant sinners in the last days.
In part I agree with you also on the fact "we don't have to worry about the last days" , unless of coarse you happen to worry and care about the unsaved???
How do you know that they were calling the bible references crap or Just Mr. Bells opinion. Now maybe nascar could have posted nicer, but did you do anything positive by coming back at him with a sarcastic remark? I think not.
Like you said you are entitled to your opinion as I am mine so I guess we will not see eye to eye but you have a nice day anyway.
parker brothers, I guess I would need more of an explanation about not being guaranteed any new days. I think I might know what you mean but won't expend any words until I know for sure.
On the other, I agree we should be concerned about the unsaved, but I was speaking purely about worrying over our own status in the last days.
jesuslives you are right. Every unnice comment seems to lower the level of communication.
"Like when I have my church if I have 1 or a 101 there I will still do what God has called me to do."
That will never have your own church, it will take too much time and effort. Remember you will need to have a 30 minute sermon each week at the minimum. You can't even put together a 10 second thought, let alone a 30 minute well-prepared sermon. I really don't think God called you. Everything you have stated is either fueled by hate, fear or soothsaying. All which are sins.
devan,
I was referring to the fact that Jesus did not come to guarantee us any more days here on earth. We are not even promised today, let alone tommorrow. That is what I was referring to as you probably guessed.
I understood the worry you were referring to. I was just hoping to call attention to the fact that worrying for the unsaved is caring about someone other than self and the effort to warn the unsaved usually brings forth the usual condemnation by most on here.
You would be surprised at what I could do , these blogs are just a starting point I have several sermons written out already.
Everyday life and current events can be a sermon.
I am just stating what is in the bible you cal it soothsaying I call it discernment.
You call it , I call it saying what it is is sin no sugarcoating. Yeah I sin we all sin I am trying to get closer.
You call it fear Yeah I do to Fear of the Lord.
Fear means reverence and I revere the Lord.
You can think whatever you want,I know what I am called to do and by this time next year I will be doing more and more.
Whether it is the Internet or the streets or my own church.
Keep on keeping on with your hate and disgust for it fuels me to study even more and to preach God's word which is the bible.
Michael Bell is a false prophet and all of you are all of you way to haveing your part in the lake that burns with fire.
jesuslives,
Glad to see you understand we can have different opinions.
My short 7 word remark was only a copy of nascars' post with a word changed in it that you called sarcastic in your opinion. You posted nearly a page of sarcastic remarks in my opinion.
"Oh and by the way YOU still have not answered my question."
Seeker of Truth,
What is false? I have not found a false statement yet. Please point out at least one for discernment.
jaxspike,
You did not understand what was asked. Let me try again. Tell me what it means to "judge" someone and give me an example of when I have done it (judging) according to you.
-- Posted by parkerbrothers on Sun, Jul 13, 2008, at 2:47 PM
"Keep on keeping on with your hate and disgust for it fuels me to study even more and to preach God's word which is the bible."
But you have used Nostrodamus and the Mayan Calender as part of your predictions... Yet you state the Word of God pushes you to use these tools as fear tactics. You even said, "If it pushes them to Jesus, I have done my job." and, "what does it matter if it brings them closer to God." Well, a gun, knife and even a car used as a deadly weapon can bring one closer to God, but you don't see people doing that? Do you?
Parkerbrothers . . .
I don't play semantics with people . . . I say what I say in a straight forward manner that is easily understood. If you can't remember all your judgmental comments the past few months then I have no desire to play nursemaid to your short term memory. Unfortunately people like you like to twist words and cause confusion among people when you know you are in the wrong to keep yourself from acknowledging that fact and unfortunately for you I do not feel the need or desire to fuel your fire.
That is all I have to say on the subject.
jaxspike,
As I thought. Not one example could you find. You answered it as best you could.
seeker of truth why don't you enlighten me then
axspike,
As I thought. Not one example could you find. You answered it as best you could.
-- Posted by parkerbrothers on Sun, Jul 13, 2008, at 8:34 PM
You have everyone else's comments saved from months on end... So surely you have all yours saved too... Seems like you have forgotten the negative things you have said, just like you have taken no responsibility for your actions... which MICHAEL "sugarcoated" (even though he doesn't like to do that) and thinks it's perfectly fine. Ironic.
What do you expect from hypocrites? The truth? or better yet, role models?
nascarfanatic,
Perhaps you can give me an example of "judging" I have done. It is easy to say someone has judged someone but quite another to show them with the Bible where they have done biblical judging.
Most non-believers favorite defensive biblical phrase is "you are judging" when someone even mentions a sin of which they dwell in.
Evil Monkey,
And the second favorite defensive biblical phrase of non-believers is " they are hypocrites" when they are put on the spot.
Parkerbrothers, what makes you think that Evil Monkey and Nascarfanatic are nonbelievers? Have you already "judge" them as so just because they dont believe the same way you do? You have just proven your judgmental ways and you know you do it but yet deny you do. Shall we call you Peter . . . how many times will you deny your own actions? I have also seen comments where you have judged gay people and others with different opinions than yours and have stated they are going to hell. Only God knows who is going to hell or heaven and what is in their hearts. You should worry more about how God will judge you and not how he judges others.
jaxsdike,
I have not said they were non-believers. I said those phrases were the number one and number two phrase used by nonbelievers. Just because they use the phrases quite often does not neccesarily mean they are unbelievers. But I might add that when someone claims the bible is a fairy tale and that Stargate has more fact than the Bible a reasonable conclusion can be drawn?
Anyone watch the anti-christ show on the History channel last night, "Noah and the Ark the True Story"?
jaxspike,
If you get time find me one example of biblical judging I have done. Asking you to find one example is not requiring you to be nursemaid to a short term memory. It is merely asking you to simply substantuate your erroneous claim. I would have no problem admitting to and repenting from such a sin if you can make me aware of it.
parkerbrothers,
How about someone that steals other peoples stuff like you did? then lies about it? What about some of the other despicable actions? What about the little childish comments? Is that something Jesus would do? Dude, you are gonna burn heh.
Unique-Lies,
I missed it. I wished you would have posted about it coming on so I could have watched it. What was discussed on it?
What did the Savior save us from?
Jesus came to save the people of the world from themselves and offer them everlasting life. By His blood we are redeemed from the powers of satan if we choose not to be under satans control and by His stripes we are healed. That covers all sins, sickness, the blind, the mad, the lame and cripple, the mentally unbalanced and insane.
Jesus didn't come here to save you from the last days nor the Trials and Tribulation. God gives power to the beast over His Saints, so you don't have a chance if you aren't strong in your believe.
The only people who will be exempt from the Trials and Tribulaton will be the people who have already died and the 144,000 who will be in the Rapture! Don't let the preachers deceive you. The Trials and Tribulation is to test the people who claim to be God's choosen people, not the evil. Everyone in the last days will be tested. The Trials and Tribulation is just the first test not the only test.
Have a nice day!
Park
You are better off to have missed it. You may have believed it.
Evil Monkey,
You can disbelieve me as you want. I can not stop you from not believing anything including but not limited to the Bible. It is a choice of yours to disbelieve as you are allowed.
I will be held accountable for my beliefs and actions just as you will be for yours. I have clearly told you what I believe in and what my source is. You can only tell me what you do not believe in.
Michael,
You like to teach on the last days and how you must be saved or go to hell.
Why not include the scriptures that tell you what Jesus himself is going to do to the people when He Returns. Teach how Jesus is going to Harvest His people after He slaughters the evil sinners who lie and cheat and have sex outside the marriage or steal and murder. Even the gifted ones who are Mediums, Fortune Tellers and Witches. And don't leave out the rich and the famous.
Then explain to all the preachers how you and they won't be in the Rapture, because the bible says only 144,000 jewish men who are virgins will be in the Rapture.
You are married and have children. That means you aren't a virgin anymore unless?? You and all those other preachers and christian leaders who have lied to their congregation are going to be disappointed when the Trials and Tribulation starts.
PREACH about the Last Days, but remember that you will be here with all the others when it happens. Your congregation will be coming to you asking you why this is happening to them. What are you going to tell them then?
Unique-Lies,
Glad to see you back up and bringing forth things worthy of comment and study.
After reading your comment I see where I could have worded something better. When I said the "last days" I was generally lumping everything that was a display of wrath and hell to come. I could have done better but did not see it could be taken as you did at the time I posted it.
You made a comment that said ... "God gives power to the beast over His Saints, so you don't have a chance if you aren't strong in your believe" .... which makes it sound like God is punishing and testing His Saints. Is that the way you meant for it to be conveyed or have I misunderstood you?
parker
No you are right. God gives power over his saints to be tested and even killed. Remember, he who saves his life loses it but he who loses his life for my sake shall save his life. Christians won't be exempt from the tribulation days. God is allowing satan and the beast to tempt all the people who are alive at that time. Some will be killed, some may survive, but most will cowardly deny God to save their own skin. God is allowing this test to be done, that is why He had it written about in Revelation. God destroyed all the people back during the flood so why do you think He is going to be nice this time?
Michael,
Uniquelies brings up some very good points that never got fully discussed in the past of which I still have questions about because they do differ in some areas from what I have been taught over the years. However, as I had mentioned before noone has spoke up and disproved any of his comments
I got sidetracked again with a lot of the useless chatter that likes to crop up on here and derail serious discussion on serious matters but would like to stay focused on serious topics for a change with confessed believers of the Bible.
What are your thoughts on uniquelies comments? If someones' comments about the Bible can not be disproved with the Bible then I think I must accept it even if it goes against traditional taught messages that can be disproved with the Bible ?
I know you are working a full time job and have a family to spend time in the afternoon with but I would appreciate your thoughts on this. We have briefly discussed part of it before but would like to study it more.
PB
Michael can't help you! There is no answer to what you want to hear.
Unique-Lies,
I think the part that is confusing me is when you say God gives this power in the first sentence and say He is just allowing it in the next to last sentence.
I know that may be considered a trivial thought but it does create a little confusion when I read it. Is He just allowing the usual freedom to Satan that he has had or are you saying that this is a punishment or test for Saints directed from God?
PB
Michael can't help you! There is no answer to what you want to hear.
Posted by Unique-Lies on Mon, Jul 14, 2008, at 11:23 AM
Unique-Lies,
I understand what you are saying. Quite naturally there is a desire to hear what you have been traditionally taught. No one likes change of that type anyway.
However, at the same time there is also the ever present desire to know more truth and the realization that I am told to discern all claims. You presented some comments that were definitely originating from the Bible which you stated as your source that I read and found no false statements in them on this topic.
I was merely asking Michael to comment on them since I know he is a believer and also know the degree of study he has put into it. Michaels comments would not be believable to me if they are not backed by the Bible so I am not asking him to tell me what I want to hear but rather his opinion with references is what I desire.
PB
Revelation 13:7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.
8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
9 If any man have an ear, let him hear.
GOD Can STOP anything at anytime, so YES, God is allowing satan and his Beast to do this. He is allowing satan to destroy the people who want to believe they are saved, but don't want to die for Jesus. Then Jesus comes down to kill the sinners and the evil people and non believers who saved their lives by denying Jesus.
This isn't confusing to me at all!
IT IS A TEST! That is why it is called "Trials and Tribulation". It is a Life threatening TEST. The last test for many! If you past this test you will have everlasting Life in the Kingdom of Heaven.
PB
We all want to hear that the end isn't going to be so gloomy and we will all be whisked away before we have to face the evil one, but that ain't gonna happen, unless you can die first or get in the Rapture.
Now don't everyone go out and kill yourself. It could still be two hundred+ years away yet according to the jewish calendars.
Revelation 13:7
On the brighter side;
All the Saints will have their names written in the Book of Life, so they will go to the Kingdom of Heaven.
These Saints will not believe the Beast nor worship him nor his image so they could be a big problem to the beast. That means just one thing. They have to be eleiminated so they can't upset the apple cart. The Saints WILL BE executed, just like all the other saints in the past. Even Jesus' disciples were executed along with his people all over the world who stood up for him.
For the rest of us, we get to choose our destiny.
Unique-Lies,
I just got back in and see the info you posted. I have to leave again but will be back later. Thanks for all the time spent on the post and I will respond back later with more questions. I hope we can stay focused on this a while as I would like to pursue it further in study.
Time for a new Blog ain't it Michael??
Time for a new Blog ain't it Michael??
-- Posted by Unique-Lies on Mon, Jul 14, 2008, at 4:45 PM
HAHAHA
If either of you two don't like what I write don't read it.
Unique lies you seem to have vast knowledge , but like everyone else it is your interpretation.
You cannot accurately prove yourself nor can I that is why I live by faith.
Evil Monkey I just don't know about you.
In times such as the ones you describe,one wonders what the believers should expect of God (and themselves) during the oppression.
When do we expect deliverance and when should we accept martyrdom?
When is resignation a lack of trust in a loving Father and when is being confident of a rescue a sign of smugness?
(Remember the Lamb that went to His death without protest.)
During the attack at Masada,men of God slew their families with their own hands then killed one another rather than fall to the invading Romans.
During the Holocaust,teachers walked into the showers with their students lest the children panic when it was time for them to be gassed.
We hear of enemy forces using suicide missions,germ warfare,"drinking the Kool-Aid" a la Jim Jones,setting booby traps,etc.
Are tactics that assume the worst appropriate for God's people?
Can a holy warrior use tactics he would deem atrocities when performed by the other side and still have a legitimate claim to the high ground?
I think the skeptical will realize we do not fight flesh and blood when the nuclear warheads,ricin,Ebola,sarin and smallpox have no effect on the last days adversaries.
But the end times (like today) will have our battle with evil be more or less inconsequential.
The war that matters will be within ourselves.
We will not fall because we serve the Anti-Christ but because we fail to honor a risen Lord.
No one at that time will be unaware of the truth about God nor will there be doubts or confusion.
There will still be oportunities to shut God out but many of the conventional reasons for being unsaved will no longer apply.
We will all have to become winter soldiers but I wonder to what degree will the chill of the final battle cripple us with fear,despair and wrath and to what degree will it refine our spirits to the greatest strength they have ever known.
michaelbell,
The Bible explains itself. If you don't believe how I explain it check out other translations besides just your bible and books.
I wasn't downing your blog or what you say in them. Just asking you to add more information about the end times to your end days sermon.
Without your blogs we wouldn't have any reason to comment. You can only add what you understand like the rest of us.
As far as lieing goes, I accuse all the preachers of teaching lies to their congregation. Jesus called them liars and hypocites and he would do the same today. I include the TV Evangelists and including Pat Robinson of the CBN. That doesn't mean I don't watch them from time to time.
I agree with a lot of your end times sermon, but it is going to be much worse than if you sin you will go to hell.
"Hell WILL BE A PARADISE" compared to what the Beast and Jesus are going to do to the people here on earth in the last days.
There will be two prophets any year now who will prophesy in Israel and will be stoned to death because the people won't like what they are telling them. These two prophets (Elijah and Enoch) will reveal God's word and what is going to happen to the people. It will scare the people so bad that they will stone them to death to shut them up.
What a shame, because these two Prophets could shed a lot of light on many subjects that have puzzeled the people for years. Just knowing where they have been all these years would be fantastic proof to hear. No one will ask these questions just like no one asked Jesus about the secrets of the world when He was here.
Everyones heart will be waxed cold and the people WILL NOT REPENT. Doesn't sound like many people going to heaven to me.
Ever thing you people believe is false; it is Satan gospel.
I will list a few false teachings.
age of accountability
man is a free moral agent
man as an immortal soul
teaching of hell
Sunday is the lords day
abortion is murder
Pick and chose; these are all false teachings are you could call it Satan gospel.
I posted That Satan is the long haired Jesus and how Satan ministers are deceiving the world.
The only people that can be saved are the ones God is calling. Believe it are not God is not calling ever one at this time only a few as a witness. The others will be called at a later time.
In the fullness of time God is going to save ever one that has ever lived. Yes even Adolf Hitler and Genghis Khan.
Michael you are mixing the gospel of the Kingdom of God with the gospel of the Grace of God. These is how I know God didn't call you to preach.
This is why the apostle Paul wrote the book of Galatians. Teacher of the Gospel of the kingdom the (circumcision) had been teaching their gospel to the gentiles the (uncircumcision). The gospel were not the same. The Gospel of the kingdom is repent and be baptise for the remission of sin. The Gospel of the grace of God is all you got to do is Believe, no baptism.
This made the apostle Paul very angry.
And I just thought everything had crawled out of the woodwork?
Unique-Lies,
I think in order to actually call all he preachers of the Gospel a lie you would have to know that they actually believe as you do but choose to lie about it and preach something differently for some reason.
What if they actually believe they have interpreted scriptures correctly? What if you have interpreted part or all of your message incorrectly? You would not be telling a lie if you believed it and thought you were presenting the truth. At least that is my interpretation of a lie. Do you have a different definition for the word "lie" that would justify you accussing all preachers of teaching lies? If so what is your definition of the word "lie"?
Parker boy you should have used a period instead of a question mark. you made a statement instead of asking a question.
Seeker of Truth,
With no hell and Jesus saving everybody including Hitler as a message you should not lack for followers on here. This sounds even better than the fuzzy ducks and cotton candy.
You would do well to continue your seeking of the truth until you actually find it.
Seeker of Truth,
I know well where I want to put a question mark.
Parker, with 36 out of the 87 comments one would think you have said something... Instead, nothing has been answered, accomplished, or achieved... just like every other blog.
Michael,
You need a new blog.. I have a few ideas: 1)Homosexuality
2)Abortion
3)McCain
4)Faith, Fact or Fiction
5)Judgment
Or... I could just archive the multiple blogs in which you have ALREADY written. LOL.. Any good news on your side of "religion"... that smile you display in your pic, is that a cover up. I have seen nothing from you that makes anyone smile. Except for your boyfriend. Who takes up nearly 50% of the blog, doing what you won't do...
parkerbrothers,
Ignorance of the law is no excuse! Ever hear that before? If you are going to teach you should know what the truth is before you start. If you learn it from man, you will only know what man has been teaching. If you learn it from the Holy Spirit, you will know what the Holy Spirit teaches.
parkerbros, if it is NOT the truth, it is a LIE whether you believe it is the truth or not. YOU may not think you are telling a lie but you ARE Lying (IF) it isn't the Truth. To call you or anyone a Liar because they don't know the truth, would be harsh, althou the bible says anyone who doesn't teach the truth is a liar and of the devil.
If I have interpreted the scriptures wrong that I discuss, then I am Lying and a Liar and my teachings come from the devil.
Unique-Lies,
You just have a different definition of the word lie than I do. I have never known the word lie to mean anything other that to intentionally state what you know if false with the intention to deceive someone and have it taken for the truth.
It sounds like you are saying that anytime anyone says anything that is not correct it is a lie.
I believe that at best it would more correctly be called a false statement and only then after it had been proved false.
Just my thoughts and beliefs on the word "lie" in today's world and the time of Jesus.
parkerbrothers
If you tell something that is not true, it is a lie rather you know it is or not.
If you intentionally tell a lie, knowing it is... well, that is Fraud and there is no statute of limitation for Fraud and carries a serious penalty! Fraud also Voids everything it touches.
parkerbros
1 John 2:27 (King James Version)
27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, ->and ye need not that any man teach you:<- but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, {and is truth, and is no lie,} and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.
If you think they can handle the cold hard truth on End Times we will do together Unique I have tons more.
Unique-Lies,
As I said earlier your definition can be different from mine or even more prominent sources such as the one below.
__________________________________________
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
A lie (also called prevarication) is a type of deception in the form of an untruthful statement with the intention to deceive, often with the further intention to maintain a secret or reputation, protect someone's feelings or to avoid a punishment. To lie is to state something one believes is false with the intention that it be taken for the truth by someone else. A liar is a person who is lying, who has previously lied, or who tends by nature to lie repeatedly.
Lying is typically used to refer to deceptions in oral or written communication. Other forms of deception, such as disguises or forgeries, are generally not considered lies, though the underlying intent may be the same; however, even a true statement can be considered a lie if the person making that statement is doing so to deceive. In this situation, it is the intent of being untruthful rather than the truthfulness of the statement itself that is considered.
_____________________________________________
God gives power to the beast over His Saints, so you don't have a chance if you aren't strong in your believe.
Posted by Unique-Lies on Mon, Jul 14, 2008, at 10:22 AM
__________________________________________
You made a comment that said ... "God gives power to the beast over His Saints, so you don't have a chance if you aren't strong in your believe" .... which makes it sound like God is punishing and testing His Saints. Is that the way you meant for it to be conveyed or have I misunderstood you?
-- Posted by parkerbrothers on Mon, Jul 14, 2008, at 10:46 AM
_____________________________________________
parker
No you are right.
-- Posted by Unique-Lies on Mon, Jul 14, 2008, at 10:55 AM
______________________________________________
Unique,
As I stated earlier I was a little confused when you posted your comment that God gave power to the beast which you explained in your post on Revelation 13:7-9. I have not read Revelation in a while but that comment struck me as a little different than what I had interpreted and created a little confusion. So I went back and read the entire book of Revelation last night and found out why I was a little confused at your interpretation. I have included the entire chapter 13 of Revelation below. As you can see in verse 4 in is the dragon who gives power to the beast instead of God as you claimed. Now that explains the small confusion your interpretation of Revelation 13:7-9 gave me briefly.
Revelation 13
1And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.
2And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.
3And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast.
4And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?
5And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.
6And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven.
7And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.
8And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
9If any man have an ear, let him hear.
parkerbrothers...Is this just 1 of you talking or 2 or 3 on this blog??? I have wanted to ask this for some time....Because it say's parkerbrother'S....Why don't you start your own blog and that way you and Mr. Bell can talk among yourselfs....I do not know why I always end up checking out this blog....You and Mr.Bell repeat the same thing over and over but use different words....I must say I get really depressed at times when I read this...i was not going to blog at all on this one...Please do not come back and say anything like I do not have God in my life PLEASE....
hehe
rebelrose,
Just me by myself. I just used the email address we have here. I believe in what I say and am not ashamed of it so I saw no need to make up a name to hide behind as some do.
No need to be depressed with Jesus as your Savior. Be full of the Joy he abundantly gives us.
Think carefully and you will know what draws you to read it.
By the way you and I had a rather lengthy exchange of communication on here about a week ago and all at once you did not answer the last question. What happened?
Why should she? you dont.
She probably quit responding when she realized having a conversation with you is like watching a dog chase after its own tail.
U.lies- I will always believe and say abortion is mu
rder except in death to the mother.
The age of accountability comes from Jewish tradition for when a Jews bar-mitzvahs is.
Sunday as Sabbath ,I am studying that one now.
The soul can die but not the spirit.
There is a hell, but it will be cast into the lake of fire.
The all time question is, does God choose you? or do you Choose God? as far as free moral goes.
A lot of what I study is Jewish traditions and customs , plus I have a Jewish bible that I study from.
It is quiet different that today's modern translations.
If I may ask what kind or which church do you go to?
We all have our takes on abortion and homosexuality and music in church and clothes and whatever.
Some believe in pre mid or post rapture or no rapture at all.
I do believe that Christian's will be martyred for their faith.
All I know for sure is
Christ born of a virgin!
Christ died on the cross!
Rose on the third day!
Ascended to Heaven!
He is my advocate with the Father!
My sins are as white as snow and will be remembered no more!
This was what was taught in the first 300 years of Christianity along with the rapture and a heaven and a hell.
If we could get back to those years and worship and believe what they did , we would be a whole lot better off.
jaxspike,
Have you come up with one comment I made that will support your erroneous claim of "judging" yet?
Or is it much easier just to post comments such as your last one. You sure make it look as if you can not debate your error.
parkerbrothers - Only God could give that power!
In Rev 13:2 The Dragon gave power to the beast because it was just raised up out of the sea and had no power until satan gave it his power, seat and great authority. In Rev 13:4,5 the beast was given a mouth speaking blasphemies and power to rule for 42 months. (3 1/2 years or 1260 days).
Now in verse 7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.
This power could not be given by satan. Only God could give the beast power to overcome His Saints.
parkerbros, you said yourself, that by his grace you can never fall away and be brought under satans power with no forgiveness. The Bible says resist the devil and he will flee, so satan couldn't give the beast power over God's Saints.
The Bible also says that Jesus returns sooner because if He didn't, all the Saints would be deceived by the beast and anti-christ.
Remember the Book of Job? God had to take the wall down around Job before satan could even tempt Job. That pretty much tells me that only God could give the beast power to make war with the Saints and to overcome them. As for everyone else, satan could give the power over them but not God's Elect.
Evil Monkey,
I answer all questions that I recognize as best I can. If for some reason I do not answer a question I at least give a reason as to why I can not whether it be lack of knowledge on my part, lack of time to address it properly, or it being a topic I am temporarily restrained from commenting on.
If you feel there is a question I have not answered nor gave a reason for not answering please by all means bring it to my attention.
While you are it check through all the above posts. There was a post on here by someone with another "hidden identity" that talks about a God and Jesus that you would probably like. He has no hell and everyone is saved including the likes of Hitler. It might be more believable to you than even Stargate. He may even support your statement of a non- resurrected Jesus if you are lucky. I am suprised you missed graciously commenting on his post.
Unique-Lies,
You can have your interpretation and believe it as you see but it clearly says that power was given to the beast by the dragon. No where does it break away and say God gave any power to the beast.
22For false Christs and false prophets shall rise, and shall shew signs and wonders, to seduce, if it were possible, even the elect.
If it were possible.
Unique-Lies,
Let me add also that just because there was a power given to the beast to make war and overcome the Saints does not imply that is was a successful war or overcoming.
The President gives power for the troops to make war and overcome the enemy but that does not mean they neccassarily overcome the enemy does it?
"hidden identity" ROFL nice try.
Evil Monkey,
No try. Just the facts.
michaelbell
I don't think you and I could get away with that. Quantumcat would counteract everything we say. Quantumcat is an excellent writer and most of the time way over my head, but the people read the soothing words and forget about the end time warnings they just read and replace it with peace of mind in Quantumcats words.
Parkerbrothers would, of course, say his bible interpretation reads something else.
As for your other post to me... I believe you confussed me with Seeker of Truth.
I believe abortion is murder, but if it comes down to losing my wife or baby, I would choose to abort to save my wife. I can always have another child.
Any day can be the sabbath. Christianity originated in the middle east so the sabbath should be the same day here as it is over there. It starts at 6 p.m. Friday evening until Saturday evening at 6 p.m. So it should be Friday or Saturday, but I like Sunday as the sabbath day. The sabbath is very important in the bible and controls many aspects in our lives.
I believe the soul of a sinner dies, but the soul of a born again christian sleeps. The spirit returns to God because it is God.
There is a hell and a hades and they will both be cast into the lake of fire.
Jesus said, "You did not choose me, I chose you and ordained you." It is by the grace of God that we even seek to find Jesus.
I am not jewish so I don't read jewish books or bibles, traditions or customs, althou I know of some. I don't bow down and kiss any walls or worship some temple. When the bible talks about Gods people rebuilding the temple, I believe it is refering to the temple within each one of us. When you come to or return to God, the temple of God is WITHIN you. When the people God wants, return to God and rebuild His Temple within them, God will return. I don't think the temple everyone is watching to be destroyed before the temple can be rebuilt is the temple the bible is speaking of. Jesus said He would rebuild the temple in 3 days meaning His own body. I believe that is what the bible is talking about, putting Christ in our hearts, mind and souls.
What church do I go to? I was baptised a Methodist, later went to a Baptist church. Studied with Johovah Witnesses a little, but now I argue the scriptures with them when one or two shows up. The most exciting and most rewarding church I have been in is the Church of God. I was raised up with Jim Baker and the PTL Club until the anti-christ IRS along with Jimmy Swaggert and Jerry Falwell sent him to prison for booking more people for rooms than he had available in his condos. The airlines do that every day and get away with it. No one goes to prison. Even the busline in Nashville sold more tickets to the July 4th event than they had busses to run. No one went to prison.
Today, I don't go to any church. I am pass the baby food and milk stages. What I know about the bible and God's word, should have been taught to the people 2,000 years ago. You could say that I view the churches as being 2,000 years behind me in their teachings. Why would I want to sit and listen to a peacher talk about things that don't teach me anything.
When a preacher tells you if you just believe in Jesus you will have everlasting life, but if you don't, you will burn in hell forever, this is saying that we will have everlast life weather we believe in Jesus or not. Hell is thrown into the lake of fire so there will be no hell to burn in forever.
When a preacher teaches that when you die you return to heaven to be with God, or you go home to heaven, I have to wonder why the preacher is telling this false story. We have never been in heaven so that is not our home to go to. We come from the dust of the earth and so we shall return to dust.
Why lie about it when the bible tells us the truth.
Here is why! Preachers are taught in man made schools and colleges and learn what man teaches them. I on the other hand learn what the Holy Spirit teaches me.
Galations 1:12
12 For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.
Abortion and homosexuallity arelisted in the bible along with what the punishment is. Since man can not live by the laws, more laws had to be written to justify man's needs to sin. The constitution is our supreme law. It guanatees us the right to do whatever we want to without injuring anyone else. We have to respect those rights. That is all that needs to be said about that.
Music in church, clothes and whatever are man made traditions and Jesus spoke out about that as well.
Many christians will indeed but not all. Some will escape the beast and live to see christ return.
You must also believe that Jesus came in the flesh and blood and He rose in the flesh and blood or you are anti-christ.
Stop for a minute and think about what it must have been like back then:
First of all a human man comes along, you know, Josephs son, the carpenter and claims to be the Christ and Messiah. Wasn't he born from that woman who claimed to be a virgin? yah right! If we would have stoned her like we should have he wouldn't be here to claim he is God. When Jesus started doing the miracles that must have been a riot. Most people would say that He was a devil or by the devil He did them. The Pharisees and Scribes had no use for Him because the people were listening to Jesus instead of them. They couldn't have that so they had Jesus executed.
After that the disciple were on borrowed time. The romans and the Pharisees were out to stop this new christian movement. Anyone talking about Jesus could be put to death so it was a hush hush when the authorities were around.
Then all of a sudden the disciple come up with more information that shoots the old way of believing out of the water. Now the gentiles could be saved just like the jews since the jews turned on Jesus. You could get married if you wanted to and preach the gospel and eat meat on friday. You didn't have to be circumcised any more to be a christian nor be a jew.
Who gave these disciples and apostles the right to teach these things?
What were the people to think. Now there is a newer religion being taught than what Jesus taught. And to top it off, it went against everything they had been taught in the past.
You think that would be a much easier way of worshipping God or learning God's word???
And now I come along and teach things that no one has ever been taught, except evil monkey, and everyone gets upset. Sorry, but that is the way it goes. The Holy Spirit will teach what it wants revealed and nothing anyone can do about it until the beast makes it a law against speaking out the truth.
parkerbrothers
A couple verses down it says that they are deceived except those whose names were written in the book of Life before the beginning. So some of these saints escape death but not the Trials and Tribulation.
All I can say is thank God there is no GOD.
Michael Bell and the parkebrothers need to be committed; they are insane.
If Michael Bell starts a church it will be a Cult, made up of a bunch of sick people.
They will be claiming they have the truth and they love God so much that they have a duty to kill all the undesirable to prove it.
They are a bunch of sickos.
Thought out history mankind has sought God. Sought to find some proof, some indication, some hope, that God is; or might be.
That search goes on to day.
Wisdom seeks to find God in the vastness of eternal space, seeks some indication throughout the far reaches of the cosmos--with the very heart of nature itself--that there is, or might be, some guiding intelligence--however remote--that would, perhaps, be God. Wisdom seeks, and continues to seek, a trace of God, but has not yet found that trace.
Upon this tiny, remote, speck that we call earth and home, and across the endless reaches of space, wisdom and science finds only nature and the workings of nature. Nothing more!
And yet, while wisdom seeks and searches in vain for a trace of God, ignorance found God. Or, at least, believes it has found God. Ignorance not only found God, but has direct information as to what God said and did, what GOD wants, what God thinks, what God likes, and what God hates.
Ignorance found God long before mankind found science; Even before the wheel was invented, or fire was captured and made a friend of man. In that barren, cold, dangerous world stood our remote ancestors. Humanity was in its infancy, Struggling to understand the force of nature, to escape its enemies, to feed itself, and, and to reproduce its kind. The human mind was emerging from the darkness of animal instincts into the beginning of reason. Its only though Survival! It was a dangerous world with enemies, everywhere and always.
parkerbrothers.....I guess i did not answer...BECAUSE it seems when i answer how I feel then you always come back with another question to my answer....and they get very deep...I am just a country woman and some of those deep questions i do not know how to answer the way I feel you would like for me to answer...Like i said I am just a country woman that believes in God and Jesus Christ with all my heart and he lives in our hearts and our home all the time...I try to live the way he wants us too and I show him my love for him by not taking him for granted and loving and caring for everyone !!!! I meet and know.....
Unique-Lies,
There is no way to conclude from reading Revelation 13 that God gave power to the beast. It is clear that the the dragon gave power to the beast. You have to add to this book of Revelation to have a meaning as you wish it to have.
Would God give the beast power to open his mouth and speak the things in verse 6 below? Only the dragon would have the beast speak these blaphemies.
The word power is mentioned in 4 of the first 7 verses below. In 2 of the 4 verses it is specifically stated that the dragon gave the beast power. I find it hard to believe you think in one verse the dragon is giving the power to the beast and in the next verse God is giving the power and then in the next verse it is the dragon giving power and then in the next verse it is God giving the beast power. It is especially hard to believe this of you when you claim such a literal interpretation of the word.
Again you are adding to the book of Revelation to make it fit your desires. The reason this was not taught 2000 years ago is because Revelation 13 nowhere says God gave power to the beast. John did not say that nor does the Holy Spirit. Uniquelies says that.
1And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.
2And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.
3And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast.
4And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?
5And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.
6And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven.
7And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.
8And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
9If any man have an ear, let him hear.
rebelrose,
You should never answer a question by the way you feel I would like for you to answer it or anybody for that matter. Just always answer questions with the simple truth. That is all anybody can do.
Angry Agnostic,
Indeed you are Angry. Replace it with the Joy a living resurrected Jesus gives. You will feel much better being joyful than angry.
As you can see in verse 4 in is the dragon who gives power to the beast instead of God as you claimed.-- Posted by parkerbrothers on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 8:23 AM
Good catch parkerbrothers. I stated a while back, not to take peoples word on quoting scriptures; since I noticed that their was always a unique twist, or something ommited in the versus posted by some.... Always have your bible by your side and read it for yourself. It is likewise to do this in church as well. My computer would not come on anymore after my last post, so I had to borrow someone elses computer to post this. I will be looking for me another one soon hopefully. Keep reading your bible, and regardless of what day it is "Sabbath day, or The Lords Day live EVERY DAY according to Gods word. Let no one turn your faith in God the Father, his Son Jesus Christ, and the Holy Spirit.
Unique Lies,
Thank you for your kind words and your insights.
If any of y'all are interested in the source of that peace of mind,read Michael's words again.
"All I know for sure is
Christ born of a virgin!
Christ died on the cross!
Rose on the third day!
Ascended to Heaven!
He is my advocate with the Father!
My sins are as white as snow and will be remembered no more!
This was what was taught in the first 300 years of Christianity along with the rapture and a heaven and a hell.
If we could get back to those years and worship and believe what they did , we would be a whole lot better off."
- Michael Bell
The blessed assurance the hymns talk about may seem quaint and unsophisticated.
It may seem too soothing and simple to have much substance.
But,I guess a part of me wants to wait until the challenges come to deal with them and,even then,I'd like to think I could have confidence in the outcome and remember that the good guys win at the end.
Hearing about rabid skunks in the park is a bit less scary if your pets have had all their vaccinations.
Storm warnings are less frightening if your home is secure,your family is indoors and you're well socked with provisions (and ready to evacuate if necessary).
Many people have nightmares about being vulnerable and unprepared (being naked in public,having to take a test when one doesn't know the answers,waking up in the midst of a fire,being on a stage before an audience with nothing to say,etc.).
While we may not always be ready for every contigency in every event,having our ducks in a row whenever possible can give us confidence even when we're caught by surprise.
Such preparation can give us a sense that the resources are out there and that we are capable of applying them to any crisis.
In that sense,a child-like faith is akin to having smoke detectors,fire extinguishers,spare tires,jumper cables,a first aid kit,organized tax records or a thick roll of duct tape.
We can see what's ahead without losing our ability to deal with the situation due to panic.
When we've done our part,we can trust God for the rest.
Does that mean we shouldn't urge others to prepare themselves also?
No,indeed!
Does it mean we can be smug and lax about our faith?
No.
It means that once we've done what we must,we can rest secure in the knowledge that there is no boogeyman so powerful that our Father cannot keep him at bay.
That can give us spiritual calm.
It can give us focus.
We can have instilled in us a new nature that can hear the enemy approach and react as a warrior and not a civilian casualty in the making.
We can have our spirits quiet because we are ignorant of danger or our qualms have been smothered by things we have swallowed that dull our senses.
Or we can forego quivering and confusion and alarm because we are certain that our future lies in God's hands rather than capricious Fate or a malicious foe.
Never assume that peace is passive or that speaking of sunshine and calm waters is a substitute for the lion and the sword.
Sometimes,our green pastures will be full of chiggers and meadow muffins.
Sometimes,having the cattle on a thousand hills will mean long hours of milking.
But,once we have embraced the simple (and sometimes troubling truths),there is nothing we cannot handle so long as we stand with our Creator.
That's Good News and a pretty good reason to look forward to the day ahead as a chance for new opportunities,new victories and new blessings without trying to predict how the day we're to "rejoice and be glad in " is going to get despoiled by those we shall see defeated.
If the tonic of truth seems bitter or burns as we take it in,it makes up for it by healing,easing pain,and being invigorating.
Don't think that the forth-telling and the Gospel are mutually exclusive.
They are two sides of the same coin and whether the coin is heads or tails when it's picked up,the person who holds it will wind up richer for posessing it -and both its aspects.
parkerbrothers and Momof3&3step&1gran;
You got me! What can I say!
I am a big boy now, so I confess, I may have been wrong about God giving the beast power over his Saints.
When I accepted Jesus as my Savior I did with the understanding that Satan no longer had power over me because I was redeemed from the powers of satan by the blood of Christ. That would include any powers of the beast as well.
Jesus said "you have no power over me lest my father gives it to you". That applies to God's Elect Saints as well.
Since satan has no power over ME, satan is wasting his time giving his power to the beast to battle with me and overcome me because only My God can give that power to the beast.
Food for thought:
God tells us to obey the governments because God gave them the power to control the people. God refers to the governments (Kings of the Earth) as Anti-christs because they will be coming to do battle with Jesus when He returns.
So you see, God is the one who gives power to beasts and kings and tyrants over his people not satan. If satan is given power over you, you weren't redeemed by His blood.
So you two are saying that Jesus spilled His Blood for no good reason at all because you weren't redeemed. How sad!
parkerbrothers
>Would God give the beast power to open his mouth and speak the things in verse 6 below? Only the dragon would have the beast speak these blaphemies.
-> Didn't you read your bible about Moses bringing God's people out of Egypt? God harden the heart of the Pharaoh and made him refuse to release God's people. He did that several times until God killed the first born son of the Egyptians. Then the Pharaoh released the people. But wait, God harden the Pharaoh's heart again and made him go after Moses and the jews. This time God slaughtered the Egyptian army to make a point to us.
Anyone God wants to destroy, He will harden their hearts first and let them do evil things so He can punish them justly. This usually is their death!
Why would the beast be any different from the Pharaoh?
God tells us that He is going to harden the hearts of the people in the last days and they will not repent. Guess what, God is going to kill a lot of unsuspecting people when He returns because of it.
Unique-Lies,
I agree with a lot of what you said in your post above but Revelation 13 is clear that the dragon gives the beast his power. You are trying to make Revelation 13 say what you want to hear.
So you two are saying that Jesus spilled His Blood for no good reason at all because you weren't redeemed. How sad!
-- Posted by Unique-Lies on Wed, Jul 16, 2008, at 11:02 AM
Unique-Lies,
No uniquelies, I have not said that. You are trying to add that into what I have said much as you were adding to the book of Revelation. That is what is truly sad in my opinion.
18For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book:
19And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book
These people did a bit of heart-hardening of their own first.
When the enemy is cut out of the picture,we have to accept some responsibility for our own behavior.
We can't just say we're bad because we were born with an imperfect nature,the devil attacked us or God hardened our hearts.
We have to admit that we could do better than we've done and that we failed to team up with God to fill in our deficiencies.
We can't be spiritually clean and whole on our own.
We are dependent on God's grace to provide what we lack.
But,despite the void within us,we don't always go to Him asking for our souls to be fed.
When He comes to us and offers to fill us with His love and strength and wisdom,we turn our container upside down lest one drop of Grace displace some of our emptiness.
No one ever is turned into a villain who sought relief from his sin-even if he didn't know what sin was or who God is.
Maybe Adolph Hitler,Genghis Khan,Charles Manson,Pol Pot,Vlad Tepes,Osama Bin Laden and George Armstrong Custer will be in Heaven.
Perhaps,at some time,they will have reached out and taken God's outstretched hand.
Our sin is never too great for God to redeem.
Perhaps,the unpardonable sin is simply whatever we fail to put under the blood.
When we can still want to give ourselves to God or ,at least,feel His absence and be repulsed by evil,then there is hope that we will be reconciled unto Him and be able to find fulfillment in our bond with Him.
When ANYthing becomes a little more important than belonging to Him,then we create a barrier that separates us from our Redeemer.
The Truth can set us free but only if we want our liberty and don't spurn His reality in favor of a lie of our own invention.
The golden calf wasn't chosen over God because people believed in it instead of Him.
They picked the lifeless idol because it was inert,ineffective and wouldn't challenge them to be who they were created to be.
They could define who their false deities were instead of belonging to a Creator who would define them.
Unfortunately,it seems that God can reach a point where he stops knocking on the doors we have slammed in His face.
He closes the portals lest a beast escape or an innocent be trapped.
At these times,the fortress we have built to keep God away becomes our oubliette and that dungeon is no less a place of torture and confinement because we imprisoned ourselves and tossed the key beyond our reach.
Could we regain our freedom if we asked for help?
I think so.
But we cannot have our liberty if we see our piece of Hell's turf as our palace and sanctuary instead of our grave.
You can not add to or take away from the scriptures of the bible. We all do make mistakes true enough. But it can be a bad mistake to tell someone the scripture is saying something totally different than what the scriptures write. That is why it is always good to have your bible by your side to read it for yourself. Everyone do not get the same meaning sometimes when they read the scriptures also.
So you two are saying that Jesus spilled His Blood for no good reason at all because you weren't redeemed. How sad!-- Posted by Unique-Lies on Wed, Jul 16, 2008, at 11:02 AM
If I did not post that then I did not say it. Also instead of only telling us what you think God said, post the scriptures where you are reading it from, so we can SEE it and READ it for OURSELVES.
Momof3&3step&1gran,
I am not smart enough to interpret the Bible on my own. I only know what the Holy Spirit allows me to understand.
-> Didn't you read your bible about Moses bringing God's people out of Egypt? God harden the heart of the Pharaoh and made him refuse to release God's people. He did that several times until God killed the first born son of the Egyptians.
Exodus 10:1 And the LORD said unto Moses, Go in unto Pharaoh: for I have hardened his heart, and the heart of his servants, that I might shew these my signs before him:
2 And that thou mayest tell in the ears of thy son, and of thy son's son, what things I have wrought in Egypt, and my signs which I have done among them; that ye may know how that I am the LORD.
Exodus 10:20 But the LORD hardened Pharaoh's heart, so that he would not let the children of Israel go.
Exodus 10:27 But the LORD hardened Pharaoh's heart, and he would not let them go.
Exodus 11:9 And the LORD said unto Moses, Pharaoh shall not hearken unto you; that my wonders may be multiplied in the land of Egypt.
10 And Moses and Aaron did all these wonders before Pharaoh: and the LORD hardened Pharaoh's heart, so that he would not let the children of Israel go out of his land.
Exodus 14:4 And I will harden Pharaoh's heart, that he shall follow after them; and I will be honoured upon Pharaoh, and upon all his host; that the Egyptians may know that I am the LORD. And they did so.
Exodus 14:8 And the LORD hardened the heart of Pharaoh king of Egypt, and he pursued after the children of Israel: and the children of Israel went out with an high hand.
Exodus 14:17 And I, behold, I will harden the hearts of the Egyptians, and they shall follow them: and I will get me honour upon Pharaoh, and upon all his host, upon his chariots, and upon his horsemen.
Exodus 14:27 And Moses stretched forth his hand over the sea, and the sea returned to his strength when the morning appeared; and the Egyptians fled against it; and the LORD overthrew the Egyptians in the midst of the sea.
28 And the waters returned, and covered the chariots, and the horsemen, and all the host of Pharaoh that came into the sea after them; there remained not so much as one of them.
29 But the children of Israel walked upon dry land in the midst of the sea; and the waters were a wall unto them on their right hand, and on their left.
30 Thus the LORD saved Israel that day out of the hand of the Egyptians; and Israel saw the Egyptians dead upon the sea shore.
31 And Israel saw that great work which the LORD did upon the Egyptians: and the people feared the LORD, and believed the LORD, and his servant Moses.
In Exodus we see that God hardened the heart of the Pharaoh to not let the jews go and to go after them after he finally released them so God could make an example out of the Egyptian Pharaoh and make the Egyptians know who God is. God hardened the Pharaoh's heart and made him do these things. This is God given power and authority to the pharaoh to do as God wished. The Pharaoh goes after God's Elect, but is killed by God instead to demonstrate God's power and Glory.
It only appeared like satan made the Pharaoh go after the jews, but in reality it was God who gave the Pharaoh power and authourity to do what he did.
In the Book of Job (Job 1:6-21), satan couldn't touch Job nor his family until God allowed him to test Job.
Job 1:22 In all this, Job did not sin by charging God with wrongdoing.
In the book of Job God has to take the hedge down before satan can even as much as do anything to any of Jobs's family or livestock or property. So satan doesn't have the power or authority to give power to overcome and distroy anyone of God's Elect. Satan has to get the power and authority from God to even tempt God's Elect.
Revelation 9:6 And in those days shall men seek death, and shall not find it; and shall desire to die, and death shall flee from them.
Revelation 9:20 And the rest of the men which were not killed by these plagues yet repented not of the works of their hands, that they should not worship devils, and idols of gold, and silver, and brass, and stone, and of wood: which neither can see, nor hear, nor walk:
21 Neither repented they of their murders, nor of their sorceries, nor of their fornication, nor of their thefts.
Revelation 16:9 And men were scorched with great heat, and blasphemed the name of God, which hath power over these plagues: and they repented not to give him glory.
Revelation 16:10 And the fifth angel poured out his vial upon the seat of the beast; and his kingdom was full of darkness; and they gnawed their tongues for pain,
11 And blasphemed the God of heaven because of their pains and their sores, and repented not of their deeds.
In Revelation people want to die and can not. God is preventing anyone from dying. After the trials and tribulation Jesus will kill the people Himself with the sword that protrudeth from His mouth.
Neither will anyone repent of their sins. They will continue to sin if sinners because God is going to harden their hearts and make them do these things.
Again, it is God who is doing these things not satan giving power to anyone to do them.
If satan has the power to give evil powers to someone over God's Elect, then they aren't redeemed from satan's power and control by the blood of Christ (nor are they God's Elect).
Unique-Lies,
A rather lenghty and good try but it is still the dragon that gives power to the beast in Revelation 13.
This was what was taught in the first 300 years of Christianity along with the rapture and a heaven and a hell.
If we could get back to those years and worship and believe what they did , we would be a whole lot better off.
-- Posted by michaelbell on Tue, Jul 15, 2008, at 4:15 PM
But wouldn't that be the so-called Gnostic texts that you have already condemned as false?
Evil Monkey,
Only the gnostics were using those text they wrote back then. Not the early church. No references by the early church fathers were made to the acknowledgement of the gnostic works. I do not think Constantine took them out of the canon circulated up to his time. He rather did not allow this sect of writings to be included in the early christian canon that had been given to them by the apostles and their followers.
What do you think? Do you have sources that say the early church (30 A.D.- 100 A.D.) was recognizing the gnostic works as canon and Constantine removed these in 311 A.D.? I believe the gnostic works were written between 150 A.D.-300 A.D. and were considered and kept secret by the gnostics themselves. Jesus told the apostles to go and spread the gospel to all the world, not keep it a secret among themselves. That fact alone should help you understand why the gnostic works were never given much if any credence as recognized canon.
I think you may be marginalizing the religions that did not have exactly the same beliefs as the proto-orthodox, both in beliefs and numbers. The Gnostic belief is somewhat older than their writings and much of their beliefs came in part from later canonized scripture. They also had many levels of Gnostic belief. Not all groups had the same extreme views. It was not until much later when they were feeling the pressure from the protos that they "helped" and reinforced their library. Before the canon, many regions may have had only a few of the later canonized books. If you were given Matthew and I were given John, could we agree on the religion of Christ, even at a fundamental level?
Before the canon, the groups were all sects, even the protos. The proto-orthodox just happened to succeed. Whether through divine intervention or good political skills and monetary advantage is another question and also a debate worth having as well.
Evil Monkey,
The gnostic books were not allowed in the Christian Bible when it was first published. Althou some of the gnostic writings WERE ALLOWED in the Catholic Bible, so there should be no problem? If anyone wants the gnostic books to worship they should go to the Catholic Faith and join them.
If the Catholics have removed any of these books, you will have to blame the Catholics. This has nothing to do with the Christian Bibles. Catholics don't believe as the christians do, so they probably still have the gnostic books in their Bible.
-> Here is a listing of most of the documents from the first two centuries.
Includes the New Testament, Apocrypha, Gnostics, and Church Fathers.
Gospels
Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, Acts, Letters of Paul,
Romans, 1 Corinthians, 2 Corinthians, Galatians, Ephesians, Philippians, Colossians, 1 Thessalonians, 2 Thessalonians, 1 Timothy,
2 Timothy, Titus, Philemon, Letter to the Hebrews General Letters;
James, 1 Peter, 2 Peter, 1 John, 2 John, 3 John,
Jude, Revelation
Gospels
Gospel of Thomas, Egerton Gospel, Gospel of Peter, Oxyrhychus 840, Gospel of Mary
Epistula Apostolorum;
Infancy Gospel of James, Infancy Gospel of Thomas, Acts of Pilate, Diatessaron,
Gospel Fragments;
Oxyrhynchus 1224, Fayyum Fragment, Gospel of the Egyptians, Gospel of the Hebrews, Gospel of the Ebionites, Gospel of the Nazoreans, Traditions of Matthias, Dura-Europos Gospel Harmony
Apostolic Acts;
Preaching of Peter, Acts of Peter, Acts of John,
Acts of Paul, Acts of Andrew, Acts of Peter and the Twelve, Book of Thomas the Contender, Acts of Thomas
Martyrologies;
Martyrdom of Polycarp, Fifth and Sixth Books of Esra, Acts of Carpus, Papylus, and Agathonice,
Letter from Vienna and Lyons, Passion of the Scillitan Martyrs, Acts of Apollonius, Acts of Perpetua and Felicitas, Didache, Apocalypse of Peter, Didascalia
Dialogues with Jesus;
Sophia of Jesus Christ, Secret James, Gospel of Mary
Dialogue of the Savior;
Gospel of the Savior, Books of Jeu, Pistis Sophia
Apocalypses;
2nd Apocalypse of James, Coptic Apocalypse of Paul, 1st Apocalypse of James, Coptic Apocalypse of Peter
Acts;
Acts of Peter and the Twelve, Book of Thomas the Contender, Letter of Peter to Philip
More Nag;
ammadi, Apocryphon of John, Gospel of Truth, Treatise on the Resurrection, Gospel of Philip,
Trimorphic Protennoia
Authoritative Teaching;
Discourse on the Eighth and the Ninth, Melchizedek
Quoted Authors;
Basilides, Naassene Fragments, Valentinus,
Marcion, Epiphanes, Ophite Diagrams, Gospel of Judas
More Quoted Authors;
Ptolemy, Isidore, Theodotus, Heracleon, Apelles,
Julius Cassianus
Apostolic Fathers;
Didache, Epistle of Barnabas, First Clement,
Shepherd of Hermas, Ignatius of Antioch, Polycarp to the Philippians, Second Clement, Epistle of Mathetes to Diognetus, Martyrdom of Polycarp
Apologists;
Aristides, Justin Martyr, Tatian, Minucius Felix,
Athenagoras of Athens, Theophilus of Antioch
Quoted Authors;
Papias, Quadratus, Aristo of Pella, Claudius Apollinaris, Melito of Sardis, Hegesippus,
Dionysius of Corinth, Rhodon, Theophilus of Caesarea,
More Quoted Authors;
Bardesanes, Maximus of Jerusalem, Polycrates of Ephesus, Victor I, Pantaenus
Anonymous Anti-Montanist,
Serapion of Antioch, Apollonius, Caius, Irenaeus of Lyons, Hippolytus of Rome, Clement of Alexandria, Tertullian, Origen
Pagan and Jewish;
Mara bar Serapion, Josephus, Pliny the Younger,
Suetonius, Tacitus, Fronto, Lucian of Samosata,
Marcus Aurelius, Galen, Celsus, Talmud, Philostratus
Jewish/Christian;
The Twelve Patriarchs, Non-Pagan Sibyllines, Odes of Solomon, Book of Elchasai, Ascension of Isaiah
Hypothesized Sources;
Passion Narrative, Sayings Gospel Q, Signs Gospel, Anti-Marcionite Prologues, Muratorian Canon, Kerygmata Petrou, Inscription of Abercias
Can you see why they were not included in the Bible?
You see... no one even has the time or interest to read all the titles of these writings let along read them in a bible. Just how accurate they are is another question.
If you were given Matthew and I were given John, could we agree on the religion of Christ, even at a fundamental level?
-- Posted by memyselfi on Mon, Jul 21, 2008, at 12:49 PM
memyselfi,
Yes, I think either of the four gospels convey the message well enough. Sometimes I think the problem is we were given too much information to consider and Satan uses it to give us minute hairs to split and deceives some into labeling them as contradictions. The message is indeed conveyed in each of the gospels individually and as a group together.
You see... no one even has the time or interest to read all the titles of these writings let along read them in a bible. Just how accurate they are is another question.
-- Posted by Unique-Lies on Mon, Jul 21, 2008, at 1:00 PM
No, I honestly don't see your point whatsoever. You feel because there is so much information for someone to read, it was left out because others were deem it too much? I do not understand your logic behind why they weren't included.
I know why they were left out and who took them out and their reasoning. Please don't feel you have induced some reasoning into something that I have already discern about 20 years ago. It still doesn't answer the question why are they still discounted as Books of the Bible today.
Evil Monkey,
Preach us a sermon from these books and show us what is missing. What would everybody have to gain from believing that Jesus is dead and did not come out of the tomb as you believe?
Can you name one thing that is to gain? For the life of me I can not see why you are so insistant in disproving the Biblical Canon and placing it below Stargate. What gives?
Have you ever thought that you are discouraging Christians from reading them when they see what they have done to your faith?
parkerbrothers,
Preach us a sermon from your Cut and Paste "sermons" you heard from a "Friends" lesson. What would everybody have to gain from believing that Stealing and Lying is from Jesus. Btw Did Jesus wear a bad brown toupee? Didn't think so.
Why are you so insistant of disapproving that those books our not supposed to be part of the Bible, Are you afraid that you might be wrong yet again? Why are you even involved in this conversation anyway, it wasn't even directed to you, midget.
Evil Monkey,
I am not insistant on proving these books are not supposed to be part of the Bible. I would actually like to see proof that they were but unfortunately have not seen it yet. I have been hoping you would show us something that could add to a belief in a Risen Savior for people to have hope and joy in.
You have continually mentioned The Gospel of Thomas. I finished reading it again last night but fail to see where it would be of any further benefit to propel the gospel. Maybe I am missing something that you could explain. We all see things differently and should help one another see the light. Just because I did not see it does not mean it can not be there. I invite you to show us the light in the Gospel of Thomas.
The last page I read last night was Logion 114 which reads:
Simon Peter said to him;
for women are not worthy of the Life.
Yeshua answered:
This is how I will guide her
so that she becomes a man.
She,too,will become a living breath like you men.
Any woman who makes herslf a Man
will enter into the Kindom of God.
Why not start your help by showing me how even this one verse can be interpreted to be harmonious with the others gospels.
In all honesty Evil Monkey the Gospel of Thomas reminds me a lot of the writings of Confusius. I believe that almost 90 out of the 114 saying in the Gospel of Thomas start out by saying "Yeshua said" much like the writings of Confusious say "Confusious said". Perhaps they were written by people out of the same area.
If you have time explain this one:
Logion 7 -
Yeshua said;
Fortunate is the lion eaten by a human,
for lion becomes human.
Unfortunate is the human eaten by a lion,
for human becomes lion.
I think I may have found(jokingly) the reason they left the Gospel of Thomas out of the Bible. The Rulers and leaders of that time would have had a hard time with the following saying:
Logion 95-
Yeshua said:
If you have money,
do not lend it with interest,
but give it to the one
who will never pay you back.
On a more serious note I did read one saying that made me think about a book of the canonized Bible which I am also studying now which is Revelation.
Logion 52-
His disciples said to him:
"Twenty-four prophets have spoken in Israel,
and they all spoke of you."
He said to them:
You have disregarded the Living One
who is in your presence,
and you have spoken of the dead.
Reading of the 24 prophets in Logion 52 made me wonder about the 24 elders that are first mentioned in Revelation 4:4 and continue being mentioned through Revelation 19:4? What do you think? Help us see the light.
It is amusing how you seem to always look to me for answers when it shouldn't matter what I think. Your belief on what books should be in or out of the Bible seems to be an issue.
Referring to the verses, it was about the priesthood. A title, not actually mutilating your penis into a vagina. You need to read before and after the verses you like to cut and paste, the pick and choose what you want to believe or not is a tad ridiculous.
Evil Monkey,
Your opinion does matter if you believe The Gospel of Thomas needs to be included in the canon. It is only when people like you who have a desire to have it included in the canon that will cause it to be looked at seriously. You have your opportunity now to have someone discuss it and look at it seriously.
In reference to your comment on looking at the verse before and after I tried. To start with there is no verse after Logion 114 to look at in the book I have. Second the verse, Logion 113, before it gives no information to support your claim. I may be missing something about it. I did though read both before and after the verse. Let me know what it is I am not seeing.
parkerbrothers,
You only read what you want to see, doesn't matter what I read as you ignore that too. You only choose to pick and believe in what you want to. No matter what you say about me will never change people's opinion because they already know the truth about you and Michael. You both have done far more damage to yourselves then anyone else could do to you. Absolutely a travesty because when your resources, you could have done alot for yourself. I just think the small-minded thinking and utter conceit you have towards people will cause more damage in the future.
So before you open your big mouth even further, really think about what you are getting into. I don't understand why you feel I need to answer to you. I am not your employee, you don't pay more, I do not serve you in any manner. I have told you several times months ago why I believe the way I do. You have so much more on the line when you feel the need to throw in your 2 cents though. Keep at it, it's funny, little people.
I sure can't wait until Aug 26th.
Evil Monkey,
I do not expect an answer from you if you have no interest in defending the Gospel of Thomas as possible canon material. I was not asking you to do it for me but rather choose to see you do it for the sake of The Gospel of Thomas itself. Out of all the gnostic works The Gospel of Thomas came closer than any to being considered as possible scripture. I thought it would have been easier to start with it. I have offered a couple of times now to give you opportunity to present your effort for The Gospel of Thomas but you do not seem interested in bringing it to fruit.
I personally feel The Gospel of Thomas has a lot of good sayings in it. I still do not see it as conveying the gospel message of Jesus Christ in it as I do the four accredited gospels of Mathew, Mark, Luke and John do.
What are you having a hard time on waiting to the 26th of August for? It is like every other day. It comes right after the one before it and right before the one after it.
Below is a link to The Gospel of Thomas. It is quite easy and quick to read since it is only 114 short 1 or 2 line sayings. Can be read in about 20 to 30 minutes. Give it a chance and see what you think. This is the book Evil Monkey had mentioned several times that he believes was left out of the Bible.
Great sayings! Gospel material??? You decide.
http://www.westarinstitute.org/Polebridg...
Keep grasping for those straws.
This is another source for early Christian writings:
http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/th...
Evil Monkey,
No straws to grasp for. Trying to help you shed light on the book that almost made it into the canon. Come on, help give it its best shot and hightlight it for us and bring out any good points you think makes it deserving of the canon. You now have a good opportunity to help us see why you think it should have been included in the canon of our Bible. Do something for The Gospel of Thomas and quit just whinning about it always being left out.
whining? ROFL, dude you are the whiner here. you whine about homosexuality, you whine about how people pick in your boyfriend, you whine about me because you can't seem to find sin. Look at the absolute hypocrisy you have shown, from stealing, to lying, to assault. And you think I need to shed light on something, Ger a life! Might be a good time to focus your energies on improving yourself instead of find faults in others.
Evil Monkey,
You seem to be missing it again. Nothing in my post is about trying to find fault. I am trying to help you give your cause a chance to be looked at. You have continually brought up these missimg books. Why not you help this Gospel of Thomas you have harped on. Why are you wanting to change the subject over to homosexuality for? Now is your chance to promote your cause. I will even try to help you bring out the positives of these few good "sayings". But you are going to have to do your part to help your proclaimed belief out. You owe it to this book to help. Don't just dessert it now. Share with everyone your belief on why the The Gospel of Thomas should be included in the Bible.
Momof3&3step&1gran,
I am not smart enough to interpret the Bible on my own. I only know what the Holy Spirit allows me to understand. -- Posted by Unique-Lies on Sat, Jul 19, 2008, at 10:27 PM
Posting the scriptures for others to read it for themselves is smart and mannerable.
Momof3&3step&1gran,
That is a good recommendation worthy of praise.
I can see why some of these alternative scriptures might take people in the wrong direction.
Believing on Christ and honoring His wishes isn't always easy.
Now,if a person could be guaranteed a place in heaven just by being a man and one could become a man by having an old acquaintance for dinner (with fava beans and a nice Chianti),that would be so much easier than the current method.
Alas,I think that the missionaries would have encouraged cannibalism,if that were feasible.
(Maybe just turn spare bits like foreskins,tonsils ,appendices and prostates into Soylent Green?
It would make things easier for the trans-gendered and people born female could dine on a bit of masculine tissue that had been lipo-suctioned and start preaching as soon as the Holy Spirit directed.)
But,if we are what we eat,why aren't we turning into cows,pigs,chickens,cocoa beans,cola nuts,coffee beans,turkeys,fish,potatoes,tomatoes and ears of corn?
I think the system that provides salvation to anyone wanting to be ruled by Love makes more sense.
If for no other reason,the red wine and fava beans would play havoc with certain meds and set off the megrims something awful.
peanutbros,
Promote my cause? What are you talking about? Do you think I am some organization or cult? I am not a Michael wanna-be nor I am trying to gain fame, fortune or a holy rollers certification of fruitiness. Your an idiot for even thinking that.
Evil Monkey,
Since nearly the beginning of these blogs you have harped on these missing books. I would have thought you would have enjoyed the opportunity to highlight these books you feel got left out undeservingly. It now seems as if you were just harping to be harping with no knowledge of how to defend your claim.
As I have said, there are some good sayings in The Gospel of Thomas. Do you have anything good to say about it? How can people believe in you if you are unwilling to ever stand up for what you have claimed to believe in?
I question how well you even know the Gospel of Thomas after telling me to read the verse before and after the verse I posted when there was no verse to follow it? Have you ever read the Gospel of Thomas?
Like I said I don't answer to you. Why do I need to stand up for what I believe in while on a blog? My actions speak for me, do yours?
Evil Monkey,
So I guess your purpose is just to harp on here about something you know little to nothing about and try to destroy the faith of people who do know and present what they know is the Gospel.
Always remember you had your chance to show you knew something about the book you always proclaimed was taken out or never put in the canon and the best you could do was tell me to read the verse before and after a verse that was the last verse of the book. You appeared to not even know there was no verse after the last verse (verse 114) of your proclaimed missing book.
I think it has been shown now why the book was never considered material deserving to be canon. The biggest proponent (you) of it on here could not give any reason to justify it even with help.
If the book that came close is not canon material I think it can be concluded that the rest have even less chance of being considered canon material that would propel the true Gospel.
Nice try, Oh so you allowed me to have a chance and I blew it eh? Are you now the self-proclaimed KING OF THE BLOGS? You are so pitifully funny. You couldn't even imagine what information I could hold and it is my decision whether to share it with you and others, NOT yours.
Good excuse. Let us know when you are allowing other kids to play in your sandbox.
But,if we are what we eat,why aren't we turning into cows,pigs,chickens,cocoa beans,cola nuts,coffee beans,turkeys,fish,potatoes,tomatoes and ears of corn?
Posted by quantumcat on Thu, Jul 24, 2008, at 3:12 PM
Have you read the names of some on here? I only wonder if it is not happening.
Sorry, no offence meant to you kitty cat. I had already hit the send button before my slow mind caught it.
I ate the Word of God and turned into a brother??
No offence taken.
I think Robert Downey.Jr. turns into a brother in his new film,Tropic Thunder.
Maybe this role will do as well as when he got a little iron in his diet.