I Thought I had Seen It All !

Thomas said he couldn't keep the pregnancy a secret, but shaving off the beard would have helped. This couple have managed to make the most out of a circus act by exploiting themselves to every tabloid and television program that will pay them the big bucks for shock value and ratings. The children have to live with historical events.

How can he be an abomination? Evidently he still possesses the equipment to have a child, the very equipment God gave her. Do you think because she had her breast removed it makes him an abomination? Would that make women who had breast cancer and had to remove their breast also an abomination? Please do not try and judge people by their choices in life. It has no affect on your salvation. You are not personally responsible for the actions of others. From what I saw on TV last night they seemed to be a happy couple much more than I can say about many many heterosexual couples. They loved their child very much. Worry more about the "abominations" who have children and toss them into the trash and the "abominations" who choose to rape and kill children.

This isn't about just having a baby, this was done for the attention. If they wanted to have a baby then why didn't the woman have the baby. This poor child is going to have a tuff childhood when class mates find out. Can you imagine the teasing.

You can be happy with Jesus!

Haha, he is so unhappy with his own life; he needs to make other people look like the bad people to make himself look better.

Er...cloning a wife via rib removal,having rocks become sons of Abraham (would the houses of slate and feldspar have feuded as much as those of Israel and Ishmael?),ancient women and virgins having babies does not express a total rejection of alternative births and conceptions.

Whether man comes up with Caesarean deliveries,anesthesia,in vitro fertilization or what,God still determines whether a child is concieved and we are still responsible for helping that child grow up to be a healthy,happy,spiritually and physically sound adult.

We make sexuality and all of our societal inteaction a lot more complicated than it has to be.

It seems to me if we just turned our individual lives over to God,our finances,our ecology,our interpersonal relationships and everything else would be in a lot better shape.

I figure He'd be pleased if we just became our own best selves and acted as He told us to instead of trying to fit in with the world's "morality of the month club" like a chameleon on a Day-Glow plaid blanket.

I have the utmost respect for Jay Pope and what he does, we don't agree on a few things, but that is besides the point.

I don't look to get my name in the paper for anything.

You have no ideal what I do or when I do it or who I do it for, and that is the way I like it God knows and that is all that matters.

By wrong direction, it might be the right one for him but not for me.

They are more youth centered where as my church will be more towards the older crowds, but still take care of the youth also.

We are all the body of Christ and have different functions.

Most of all is the persons soul, a house, a job and life's necessities are fine, but not if the person is still going to hell.

My job may be just to preach and if it is I am going to do the best that I can.

And as far as real Christians go don't just take a good deed as a sign, the wolf will come in sheep's clothing and mingle with them until it is

time for lunch.

Jay and me had a long talk before my family and me left, I was not growing in my calling because I was following his , so I left.

The church was being run for a select group and some felt left out, I had the nerve to speak my peace, if it caused hard feelings I am sorry, but that is how it goes sometime.

At least I have a purpose , what is yours?

Go visit the church, if you like it great if not there is one on every corner.

I am not judging, just making OBSERVATION that goes along with the bible, therefore I do not feel guilty.

A story like that does not need the publicity.

A story like that does not need the publicity.

-- Posted by michaelbell on Sun, Nov 16, 2008, at 8:38 AM

And yet here you are giving it even more publicity

-- Posted by Dianatn on Sun, Nov 16, 2008, at 9:43 AM

HAHAHA... The irony! He just wanted an argument. Nothing more.

I have to ask, if this blog and my comments were to be in favor of abortion, same sex marriage, trans-sexualism and all the other things the BIBLE states are wrong, would it be a accepted and liked blog?

If I were to support the group NAMBLA OR bestiality would you find that offensive?

If I were to be in favor of pedophiles would that be celebrated?Posted by michaelbell on Sun, Nov 16, 2008, at 10:03 AM

You see, Michael, that is the entire problem, no one has ask you to support it..They are not doing anything that is against the law. So basically what they are doing is none of your business. If you don't agree then the was your CHOICE to turn the TV channel over and not watch. There is tons of things in this world I do not support and there always will be but as long as they are not breaking the law or it doesn't affect me, then it is none of my business.

What if it is God's law? Posted by michaelbell on Sun, Nov 16, 2008, at 11:17 AM

Again the problem begins with your view of what God's Law even is.. Not everyone believes or reads the Bible the same way you do. That's what is called Freedom of Religion, Look it up you may find it interesting.

Christians are to abide by the law of the land... this is true, and they should be obedient to the secular authorities (Titus 3:1

When man's law tries to supercede Gos's law then we all have to decide I choose God's law!

How do you know how I look anyway?

Bible speaks plainly about homosexuals and I would think that if God wanted mento have babies he would of made them that way.

If the person's DNA says they are one sex and the external genitalia say something else,then medical treatment may help the appearance match the person's sexual identity.

As for the rest,I wonder if people may get the idea that they are the "wrong" sex because they don't match up with the world's stereotypes.

If they weren't told what being a male or female meant then they might be a person first and figure out they are an individual with certain traits rather than a robot programmed a certain way.

You don't often see a Labrador Retriever who hates water or a cat that is sociable heading to the vet for modification.

They do the best they can with who they are and let the sterotypes be a record of what is most common-not a mandate for every member of that group.

Does a person need hormones and surgery because he or she doesn't feel like what their gender is "supposed" to dictate?

Those measures might be as necessary as hair straightening or curling,skin dyes or bleaching or nose and eye modification for someone who doesn't "fit" the little boxes set aside for their race.

The enemy creates these cages.

God tells us that we bear His image.

Whether we dye,perm,iron,add or subtract our hair,he has each hair numbered (even the ones on our backs).

We may wear dentures or braces or file our teeth into points but we're still to have His smile.

We can remove ribs,bind our feet,get pectoral,buttock or calf implants,tattoos,rings around our necks,plates in our lips and piercings but the external changes (however permanent) don't change who we are.

They may alter how the world judges us or how we perceive ourselves but God looks upon our hearts.

He doesn't ask us to conform to the world's ever changing dictates.

He wants us to be ourselves-without shame or compromise.

Can we change our outsides without going against God?

Yes.

But,we can't let the enemy convince us that external "perfecting" is all we need or that the real us must be eradicated at all costs.

We need to be true to God's design for us and be as functional physically and spiritually as possible.

If that fits with what the world endorses,fine.

If not,maybe we'll start a new trend.

A lot of "abominations" would be absent if we recognized that being true to God leads us to being true to ourselves and,as the Bard suggests,if we are true to who we are,we can't be false to anyone else.

Religious zealots like you(Mr. Bell) are the main problem. If one does not adehere to your interpretation of the Bible(or any other religious book) they are doomed to Hell. The main point of Christianity is forgiveness. While I do not condone many activities, I will not condemn them for what they think is right for them to do.

I am not a religious zealot, but a Jesus zealot.

Religion is what the problem is, all I ask is you accept Christ, you follow Christ, you adhere to the Bible, that simple.

How would you know about Jesus,God or what is right or wrong without the bible?

The bible is all I have and God vindicates it when he talks to me.

We are supposed to judge people by the bible, if they don't line up with what the bible says then they are liars.

Prophecies have come and are coming true as I write this that were foretold in the bible.

Old Testament foretold Christ and New Testament fulfilled Christ.

The bible say "who has ears let him hear " , well I hear and I obey.

I research the oldest text I can ,I research Jewish and Greek sources, and study with people like Perry Stone, John Hagee, Jack Van Impe and the late Herbert Armstrong and Gene Scott, who all have great insight into the bible.

The bible is my foundation and I stake my life on it, not as a book, but as the inspired word of God.

Hoe else would we no what sin was, or redemption, or the saving grace that was the cross?

To many of you believe in the secular teachings of faith and God, I will always put my faith in the word of God! The Bible!

LOL.... Hey Michael, while seeing fit to continue preaching from the keyboard your former pastor was out doing good works... You know being a Jesus Zealot as you call yourself.

HAHAHAHA. You are so funny because really, the only thing you've done since last August is alienate more and more people, and bring about more and more doubt of the word. That is so sad, because you really could have been a light to this community, instead a year later, you are good at dividing people using speculative rhetoric.

Michael,

I was flipping through the channels and found your boy, Hagee, spewing his hateful message. While he was right about debt being an enemy he proceeds to say something that goes beyond ignorant.

As most of us know, we are in a bit of economic downturn. Nothing we won't come out of, of course, but still pretty painful for many. Hagee then tells his faithful followers that if they miss a payment or are late on a payment, God then lumps the debtor in the same category as 'the wicked'. Having quoted proverbs about repayment of debt, he essentially fails to see that many enter debt with a means and a plan to repay. I am sure many of his followers hang on his every word and believe this crap!!

Again,all are responsible for debt repayment, I do not argue that. But to say that God lumps them in with the wicked for an unexpected economic hardship is repugnant.

If you follow this cook,it is no wonder you say what you say.

St. Paul....

Pretty much! If he wasn't, tell Michael to prove it.

I'll take Hagee anyday!

King James only authorized the bible to be printed in English, and to think Paul was a homosexual is simply ludicrous.

Like I stated before, I do what I do not for man's attention, but God's.

I could care less how people view me.

The ones who are the same way will hook up with me and we will work together to spread the word.

If any of you don't like what Michael writes in HIS blogs then why are you reading them. You have a choice no ones twisting your arm to read them.

As far as the couple having a baby it was done for money and publicity, Oprah and Barbara paid them to come on their shows.

Evil Monkey,

Homosexuality brings itself up on a regular basis trying to seek and gain more and more approval.

If theivery and stealing was marching and protesting for equal rights I would be mentioning them instead.

I do not get to choose which evil is dominant for any period of time. I had much rather it be another evil myself than what is currently prodding forward.

I find it funny that you bring up homosexuality, gerbils and bestiality up on a regular basis too. I guess those are some of your regular activities since you seem to enjoy talking about it so much?

-- Posted by Evil Monkey on Mon, Nov 17, 2008, at 11:08 AM

Evil Monkey,

That makes almost as much sense as saying you (EvilMonkey) is a homosexual because you defend it so much?

Actually someone who condones it as much as you do would actually appear a little more likely to be one than the person that condemns it as I do? Could not that be even funnier?

Don't you think??

Maybe he thinks you are one sexy little monkey . . . he cant help himself. LOL!

Just becareful that he dont want to SPANK the MONKEY!

Jaxspike,

You are just TOO much!! LOL

Just becareful that he dont want to SPANK the MONKEY!

-- Posted by jaxspike on Mon, Nov 17, 2008, at 1:06 PM

jaxspike,

I thought we were leaving that for you and darrick04 since you two made up and were holding hands a while back. :))

Darrick_04 and I actually never "made up" as you say . . . we just haven't talked to each other period since then. Thanks for the concern . . .

But really, there are so many different issues and things that Michael could discuss about when it comes to Christianity and could serve God in a better way but he continues to go back to subjects like this. Religion will always involve a lot of different opinions because everyone interprets the Bible differently (why do you think we have so many different types of churches and religions in the world). If you are going to open yourself up to religious discussions, then you have to be willing to recognize people will have different opinions and that they feel it is just as valid as yours. God may speak to people in different ways and who are you to say otherwise?

(starts humming "And they'll know we are Christians by our love.")

It's a good thing the Times-Gazette has it in print that some of us are born again.

Without that kind of corrobaration,folks might think that the spirit within us was some cranky old Go'uald like Apophis or somebody.

Can we try showing a wee bit more Godly reason and love and a bit less in-fighting?

We can argue about homosexuality,the end times,the Filique clause,transubstantiation and eternal security.

Or,we can so live our lives that those around us will want the peace and power of the Holy Spirit.

We can give evidence of how lives can be enriched by faith in the way we conduct ourselves.

If we not only search the Scriptures daily to discern the truth but call upon the Lord to teach us His will that we may apply the Word in all we do,then the issues of the day will take care of themselves.

We run the risk of trivializing the very issues that have become our obsessions when we focus on

man's limitations and ignorance instead of God's infinite and perfect Self.

Our forth-telling should be a by-product of the wisdom and grace we have been given.

It should be an extension of our love and our immersion in the world on God's behalf.

It should not be a sword we use to wound and kill but a scalpel we use to remove the dead and corrupt that the rest might heal and gather strength.

We must ask ourselves if our natures and our examples affirm the worth of a Godly life and beckon people toward the Source of our joy-or do they see people as snarky,depressed,close-minded,

self-centered,fearful and mean-spirited as the lost.

We can't think our spiritual worth comes from the sins we don't committ or the good deeds we perform.

We belong to Heaven because of Christ's sacrifice on our behalf.

We are saved by His Grace-not our own.

Any good we do is a result (not a cause) of our redemption.

That makes us little different from those people whose spiritual journey is different from ours.

They may have more,less or different flaws and burdens from us but they have the same God who has offered them the same healing that we claim.

Too often,we look at the world (and even ourselves) and think it's our duty to somehow remove the darkness that surrounds us.

We get burdened with anger,fear and hopelessness at the enormity and futility of that task.

We forget how much simpler and within our ability it would be to add Light instead of attempting to subtract the dark.

We can try to excise a void or we can try to fill it.

If we focus toooo much on the world's ills we could get overwhelmed,overlook something life-threatening or try to change something that's not harmful.

If our first priority is to promote health,then much of the damage the world has been subjected to can be healed or repelled just by bolstering its strength.

To use a favorite gardening analogy again,we can start poisoning and hacking a beleagured garden to rid it of invaders-even at the risk of pulling a "weed" that's a precious flower.

Or,we can give the garden Light,Living Water and nourishment and trust that those that belong in the garden will prosper more than the pests.

Most of the time,one can tell a blight by the fact that it can't thrive in the presence of prosperity and wholeness.

It has to take advantage of or initiate weakness.

Sometimes,God even sends a nuisance to restore a damaged area.

(Bitterweed adds calcium to the depleted soil where it grows.)

If we don't like our prophets,we can attack them-or we can make them unnecessary by remedying or preventing the problems they might protest.

If dealing with the enemy's predatory ways is a hassle,maybe we could get by with bolstering people with hope and courage and affirmation.

You would probably end up with the weeds choking out the precious flowers. At least from my experience I have never seen a flower garden that did not constantly need to be weeded.

-- Posted by parkerbrothers on Mon, Nov 17, 2008, at 5:21 PM

Sometimes those things that appear to be weeds at first glance are actually flowers that have not bloomed :>)

Actually the site is about idiots on the internet. You were voted on by over 7000 members to be the Top Idiot of the Year. So to say it was all about you is quite the contrary. The people that read the posts here from the site cut and paste your crap and laugh and vote on it.

Michael if the Lord is leading you to write something then write it, not matter what others may say. People have been trying since the beginning of time to silence Gods word, but it will never happen.

God bless you and your family

You were voted on by over 7000 members to be the Top Idiot of the Year.

Posted by Evil Monkey on Mon, Nov 17, 2008, at 6:11 PM

Do I get a trophy? :))

Did any eviloranotangs or evilgorillas get to vote or was it simply a vote among you evilchimps? :))

Is that your bungle in your jungle?

michael,

Maybe they will claim it is in their genes to read your blogs and they have no choice.

Remember, kinda like they said they said they had no choice to repent of homosexuality because it was in their genes.

Maybe they will name it the MBB08(Michael Bell Blog) gene?

Hey, you have a reason too for writing the blog. It is because of the MMB07 gene that causes you to crave writing in a way you can not stop. You have no choice. If for nothing else they will simply have to give you understanding because it is in your genes.

Pastor Mike

Notice the secret word of the coming year. (HATE) That why this group is fighting for the hate bill to be passed. If it passes it will help do away with freedom of the press,free speech,and expression as we know it.

Of course that will label the Bible as an unfit book and it will be removed from the store shelves. As one of our western states is now debating this very issue.

There is more hate and bigotry coming from their side because they don't want us to express our beliefs, and warn them what in store for them as we understand God's word.

A lot of them are so set in their ways they can't see the forest for the trees. Keep trying -- maybe you can bring one or two back into the fold, and God will say well done, Mike Bell, you good and faithfull servant. God knows the difference between love and hate even if they don't. Remember that is the only weapon they have to try to get their way legally.

Parker

To answer your question which I know you know the answer is two things.

#1 We all fall into satan's traps for self gratification or needs of the moment.

#2 satan's cunning and assurance that you are right God didn't mean what he said about the issue. Same old trick he used on Eve about dieing.

We don't hate the sinner, we hate the sin, big difference

quatumcat

I disagree with you in part. Yes I don't want to see anyone mistreated mentally or physical. Don't think it's all on a oneway street because it's not. I have meet men who were raped by people of the Gay movement and beat and kicked to an inch of their life.

You can witness on this blog what they think of guidance. That is all brother Mike is trying to do. Go back and notice where most of the hostlity and hate is coming from and directed to. If it was me after one attempt I would abandon them and let them go on their way.

Sex was designated for one purpose and that is procreation, not as a sporting event for either side.

It is a measure of life or death in this day and time.

Man to man or feamale to female will not fulfill peoples life needs without children present to love and nurture. The best way they can procreate is by adoption and try to raise their child to there way of life. Where does freedom of choice fit in for that child. Yes Jesus loves them and want no harm coming their way.

Just freedom of choice and brother Mike is pointing that out. Bacause of that he is called a bigot and several other words.

God laid this message on his heart for their salvation and that is his cross he has to carry and is carring it well.

yes we can

No Mike didn't lie to you. He told you the truth how his body feels. His body recoiled against something that he would not be a party to. He made a choice to love that person anyway. You, on the other hand, don't believe any violence or showing of hate can or does come from that group. I say you are very naive and self centered.

Look back in the Bible for one refrence on their behavior towards Lot's guests in Sodom.

Don't pretend no violence comes from that side. You may go with me on my next trip to California or New York, and I will introduce you to more than one person that has experenced violence from that group while trying to help them. You tell them they are lying, that it didn't happen, to there face, if you are brave enough. I didn't say all were like that, but there are people on both sides that show the hate trait, including you from your response. Mike told you how he feels, with truth, and love you can't handle it. As I said before, I also will not condone your preference of lifestyle because it goes against nature, and the will of God to me also. Mike, on the other hand, has made a decision to love you regardless of how he feels or how his body reacts by warning you of what he believes the out come will be for you with out repentance towards God.

As for as I'm concernd I wouldn't take the verbable abuse he takes trying to explain. I on the other hand would let you go and let time settle the issue.

You can sugar coat your choice to mankind, but not to the Holy Trinity. My last words to you, yes we can, is exactly that-- yes you can. It is your choice. Go for it.

As a pastor or even just a Christian brother I would not resort to violence against any sinner, just their sin.

We all have them and need to help each other with them.

Hopefully in the near future there can be a counseling service set up as with former drug abusers and alcohol abusers.

But to tell anyone that there is no absolute right or wrong and to let them stay in their sins is the worst thing you can do for them.

You as a Christian will be judged for your sins, but for others sins as well, if you point out their sin and they repent, great, if not, you wipe the dust off your feet and go on.

You wash your hands of the situation and you are not held accountable.

That is the wonder of God's love and his Son's sacrifice, you are not forced to accept it, but to not is a death sentence that cannot be reversed, to accept it is eternal life, the choice is yours.

The bible says that every knee shall bow and every tongue will confess by the end of time, I just choose to do it now.

But to tell anyone that there is no absolute right or wrong and to let them stay in their sins is the worst thing you can do for them.

Posted by michaelbell on Thu, Nov 20, 2008, at 5:42 AM

michaelbell,

I agree. You sure would not do that if you are a Christian and loved them.

It sounds like something you would do if you were not a Christian and they were your enemy.

Life is so short here. Why not everybody try to lead someone away from the sins that can damn their soul eternally and to a Saviour that will take their repentant sin and place them onto his account and provide redemption giving them eternal life free from the sins and sorrows of world life.

A lifetime here in world time is not even a fraction of a second compared to eternal life.

If you can love somebody, lead them in the right direction, for their sake.

Anyway, I agree with Michael that letting someone stay in their sins is a pretty awful thing to do. That is why I hope you all read my words and understand what you're doing wrong.

-- Posted by yes we can on Thu, Nov 20, 2008, at 10:47 AM

yes we can,

Why do you think it is wrong to let someone stay in their sins? Especially if it is something that brings enjoyment to them.

I seem to remember a popular cable television show called "Queer Eye for the Straight Guy". I guess it depends on who is using it and how. In fact, I'm not so sure us straight guys shouldn't have been offended. :)

Do you think using the word n****r in reference to black people is okay

Posted by yes we can on Thu, Nov 20, 2008, at 12:00 PM

yes we can,

Most all the black friends I have cut up and aggravate and actually call me n****r and I call them crackers but we all know what each means. I see nothing wrong with using either one when you realize that the n****r word is nothing more than a slow progression of pronounciation of the proper spelled word Negroe. I remember growing up when a lot of older people then pronounced it Negra and Neggro and Nigra when trying to help clarify something.

It has never bothered me to be called honky. I guess I could complain and ask everyone to spell it h***y when they call me honky or c*****r when they call me a cracker.

But really, don't we all know what it means without having to use all the little **** with words.

you just repeat the same tired arguments that Baptist preachers have been wearing out since the Stonewall riots

-- Posted by yes we can on Thu, Nov 20, 2008, at 2:49 PM

yes we can,

I would say that the "same tired arguments" are a little older even than that. At least a couple or three or four thousand years older.

God is the same yesterday as He is today and as He will be tommorrow. The argument just isn't going to change a whole lot. Even in the next two to three thousand years. Wrong yesterday, wrong today and wrong tommorrow. It is indeed a pretty old and tired argument but it is what it is. Only an act of Satan can sugar coat it.

No lies just facts because I believe what the man told me.

If you remember I was trying to point out there are rotten eggs in both camps. Evil isn't contained to one group as you seem to want us to believe. You do realize bad runs on both sides even if you are in denial. Now you won't admit to be part of this group and I say if the shoe fits wear it, don't be ashamed of who you are, because it will not matter to most people, because most believe bottom line it's your choice and respect you for that choice. Your vigor in defending this group make me believe you are deeply involved. You would have us believe they are gentle little sheep never do anything wrong. I believe actually wolves in sheep clothing is the better terminology for some of them. I do wish you well, but I also believe you are lying and trying leed us astray of your real purpose on this blog. Now if you wish to speak to me personally and discuss it futher try this number 684-5583. At that time I will expect your name.(it will be kept private)

The offer still stands you may ride with me on a trip so you can talk with him if you wish if not that is all I will do because he has been badgered enought.

"The most henious and the must cruel crimes of which history has record have been committed under the cover of religion or equally noble motives."

I was always taught God loves all his children. He may not always approve of somethings we do, but loves us just the same. The Bible says to humble yourself as a small child, to ask for true forgiveness, to commet YOUR life. These things I have done. I try not to bring any harm to anyone. I try to do what is right. You know, love thy brother as thyself. I may not always agree with the way others choose to live. But, as the Bible says thou shalt not judge. It is not our place. Anyway thats what my Bible says. Ijust find it strange that a blog set up to discuss such an issue, is so full of hatred.

But, as the Bible says thou shalt not judge. It is not our place.

Posted by HallsMillMom on Sun, Nov 23, 2008, at 9:58 AM

HallsMillMom,

But it is our place to discern sin and the Bible is quite full of proper ways to handle dealing with both the saved and unsaved entangled in sin.

Huge difference between judging and discerning. The particular verse you are probably referring to does not mean to turn a blind eye to any or all sin.

That particular verse is probably one of the most misused in the Bible. It is the number one thing qouted by the sinner to postpone acknowledgement and the first thing used by Christians to avoid confrontational issues with helping someone. They can remain lazy and actually uncaring Christians by using the verse to simply do nothing or say nothing about known sin in the life of a fellow soul.

Unique-Lies,

Again, you know better than to take things out of order and context to misrepresent facts.

There is a difference between judging and discerning. You try to present some verses that will justify the thought we are never to confront someone about sin because we would be "judging" someone. Wrong, wrong, wrong. Another of your not so uniquelies.

Telling someone the consequences of sin is not judging someone. The County worker putting up a 30 mph speed sign is not judging someone. When a police officer pulls you over for speeding he is not judging you. He will give you instructions on where you are to go but the officer is not going to be your judge. Only the judge can pass sentence. The officer simply cited your infraction of which the judgement comes later by the judge.

Again, another misapplication of verses by you to mislead.

As I said earlier Satan has misused those verses so much that he has even convinced a lot of Christians that they will be guilty of "judging" if they even mention known sin to anyone.

We as Christians are to discern sin and warn people of the sickness it brings which leads to death. Only after someone has become aware that they are sick will they know they are in need of a good physician. Then we have the opportunity to recommend the Great Physician to them that will take all their sickness upon Himself and bear it so they can be healed and have eternal life.

Jesus came to heal the sick. The biggest problem He encountered was the ones who knew not they were sick. He could not help them or anyone until they realized they were sick.

If you love someone, let them them know if you see sickness in them so they will get to the Physician and get healed.

Don't let Satan convince you that you will be "judging" someone if you see sickness in them and truly want them to be healed. Jesus never condemned anyone for bringing the sick to Him.

17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

Posted by Unique-Lies on Wed, Nov 26, 2008, at 3:27 PM

Unique-Lies,

Works is nothing but a possible and probable aftermath of salvation, never a prerequisite of salvation.

James was referring to being justified before men with works. You are never justified or righteous before God with your works. They are nothing but filthy rags to God. Righteousness can only be imputed to you. Never can you be righteous by any and/or all your efforts. You can neither earn nor keep your righteousness. Salvation is only possible through the imputed Righteousness of Christ. You can only by Faith come in contact with this imputed righteousness. No works needed nor accepted.

Romans 4

1What shall we say then that Abraham our father, as pertaining to the flesh, hath found?

2For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not before God.

3For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.

4Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.

5But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

6Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works,

7Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered.

parkerbrothers,

In the last days the people will be deceived by the devil and his angels and worship the false prophet and the beast. It looks like that has already started happening.

It proves that I am not the devil's angel because no one believes what I say. The world seems to be agreeing with YOU and your interpretations of the scriptures! Looks like the evil is winning just like it was foretold.

I realize that works won't buy your salvation, but without good works your faith is dead. We will be judged by our works in the end.

I leave you with this last verse for you to twist around to make everyone believe whatever it is you want them to.

Revelation 20:13

13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their "works".

I guess the Lord is going to judge you according to your filthy rags.

parkerbrothers

You have preached over and over to me that your works (and mine) are but filthy rags to God, but now all of a sudden they are not regarded as Filthy Rags, but your reward?

Believe me you will get your reward!

--> I leave you this Thanksgiving morning with the beautiful God Inspired Words of the Loving Apostle John:

John 14:27

27 Peace I leave with you, my peace I give unto you: not as the world giveth, give I unto you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid.

This is the peace that surpasses all understanding. I Thank God for Giving this Peace.

-- Posted by parkerbrothers on Thu, Nov 27, 2008, at 8:03 AM

Psalm 34:9

FEAR the LORD, you his saints, for those who FEAR him lack nothing.

Luke 12:5

But I will show you whom you should FEAR: FEAR him who, after the killing of the body, has power to throw you into hell. Yes, I tell you, FEAR him.

Matthew 10:28

28 And FEAR not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather FEAR him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

Happy Thanksgiving to you, You fearless leader of Christianity?

Psalm 34:9

FEAR the LORD, you his saints, for those who FEAR him lack nothing.

Posted by Unique-Lies on Thu, Nov 27, 2008, at 12:16 PM

Unique-Lies,

Do you understand the word translated to "fear" in this verse?

Irregaurdless of your understanding of the word I will say that we should all fear standing before God with our own righteousness. However we can stand at peace before a perfect God if we are clothed with the imputed Righteousness of Christ. Only Faith will bring those garments to us.

Fear means to hold in reverernce, not like the English word fear.

parkerbrothers,

The fear that I talk about is the fear of what Christ can do to you. Until we become saved we don't fear the LORD because we don't know him. After we are saved that is when we need to fear what he can do because our life is in his hands. We fear the LORD so we will walk in his light and not in sin.

Fear means to hold in reverence, not like the English word fear.-- Posted by michaelbell on Fri, Nov 28, 2008, at 6:55 AM

It also means to fear as we would fear something horrific. (A good example is "Every knee shall bow down before the LORD". This isn't just the ones who bow down because they Love God. Many will kneel down out of fear).

Now here is how some of you Christians look at being saved: Once you receive Christ as your Lord and Savior, you are saved forever and are guaranteed an eternal life in heaven.

You say we can continue to sin because we are all sinners and not perfect, yet that is why we accept Christ, so we will be righteous with God, who by the way, lives inside of us, making it impossible to sin.

This is a good example of you not fearing the LORD, because you think you can do anything and God will still love and forgive you and give you eternal life in heaven.

However, you all draw the line here:

If homosexuals, fornicators, idolaters, adulterers, effeminates, abusers of themselves with mankind, thieves, covetous, drunkards, revilers, and extortioners find God and accept Christ as their Lord and Savior, they should have the same right to continue sinning as homosexuals, fornicators, idolaters, adulterers, effeminates, abusers of themselves with mankind, thieves, covetous, drunkards, revilers, and extortioners as long as they keep asking for forgiveness and still have the same blessing of eternal life as you have.

Yet you say neither homosexuals, fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminates, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God, but you will because......................God Loves you more than He does all those other sinners??

Just where do you draw that line? I have never read about it in any bible!

Should they "fear" God or just keep on thinking God Loves them and will take them to heaven with the rest of the sinners?

You are preaching a double standard. If you preach that you can continue to sin and be taken to God's Kingdom for an eternity, then you can not preach that other sinners don't have the same rights as you have to eternal life and God's forgiveness.

And you say you are not judging them... You are their judge, jury and executioner!

michaelbell,

If you would explain to me what is considered sin.

-> James 4:17 Anyone, then, who knows the good he ought to do and doesn't do it, sins.

Who goes to heaven or hell is God's will not mine.

-> 1 Thessalonians 4:3-6

3 For this is the will of God, [even] your sanctification, that ye should abstain from fornication:

4 That every one of you should know how to possess his vessel in sanctification and honour;

5 Not in the lust of concupiscence, even as the Gentiles which know not God:

6 That no [man] go beyond and defraud his brother in [any] matter: because that the Lord [is] the avenger of all such, as we also have forewarned you and testified.

But to me a person that commits those sins, comes to Jesus and still commits those sins should be in question.

-> James 1:12-16

12 Blessed [is] the man that endureth temptation: for when he is tried, he shall receive the crown of life, which the Lord hath promised to them that love him.

13 Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:

14 But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.

15 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.

16 Do not err, my beloved brethren.

I got saved and with the Holy Spirit, I quit cussing, drinking, drugs, and all other things.

-> 1 Corinthians 12:12-31

12 The body is a unit, though it is made up of many parts; and though all its parts are many, they form one body. So it is with Christ.

13 For we were all baptized by one Spirit into one body--whether Jews or Greeks, slave or free--and we were all given the one Spirit to drink....

-> Hebrews 6:4-6

4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,

5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,

6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put [him] to an open shame.

If a person who is saved does slip into sin then that is what repentance is for.

-> Repentance is being sorry for your sins and not doing them again.

Hebrews 10:26

26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,

-> Hebrews 6:4-6

4 For [it is] impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,

5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,

6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put [him] to an open shame.

The Israelites got times to repent every year.

-> Numbers 15:28-31

28 The priest is to make atonement before the LORD for the one who erred by sinning unintentionally, and when atonement has been made for him, he will be forgiven.

29 One and the same law applies to everyone who sins unintentionally, whether he is a native-born Israelite or an alien.

30 " 'But anyone who sins defiantly, whether native-born or alien, blasphemes the LORD, and that person must be cut off from his people.

31 Because he has despised the LORD's word and broken his commands, that person must surely be cut off; his guilt remains on him.' "

Christ died once to save the world, he saved us once, but because of man's weakness, man can and will slip up.

-> If you slip up, you and the harlot are one flesh. If you don't sin again you and the Lord are one spirit.

1 Corinthians 6:15-17

15 Know ye not that your bodies are the members of Christ? shall I then take the members of Christ, and make [them] the members of an harlot? God forbid.

16 What? know ye not that he which is joined to an harlot is one body? for two, saith he, shall be one flesh.

17 But he that is joined unto the Lord is one spirit.

-> Hebrews 10:10-12

10 By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once [for all].

11 And every priest standeth daily ministering and offering oftentimes the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins:

12 But this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God;

I don't ask Jesus to save me anymore, he already did that, I repent of my sins, whether in thought or deed and do my utmost best to not repeat it again.

-> You asked God to forgive you of your original sins, but since then you have committed several other sins which you have not been forgiven for if you don't ask for the forgiveness. Future sins wouldn't be covered with old prayers for forgiveness. New sins need new prayers to be forgiven. Same ol repeated sins means you haven't repented, therefore they are no longer forgiven.

Grace is not a one shot deal!

-> Grace determines your fate. If you were destined from the foundation of the earth to be saved, you will be saved. If not, you won't be.

-> The one shot thing, is eternal life. We receive eternal life when we accept Christ. Some Christians believe we all have eternal life... in heaven or hell! The fallen angels who had eternal life were chained up in hell until judgment day. They will have an eternal life in the lake of fire. So we have to be careful what we pray for.

-- Posted by michaelbell on Fri, Nov 28, 2008, at 4:02 PM

parkerbrothers,

If you accept the mark of the beast, you will lose your salvation. The bible tells us that the beast will deceive everyone except for a handful of his saints, and that is only because Christ returns earlier than originally planned.

If you worship the beast or his image, you will lose your salvation. So what makes you think you won't lose your salvation by sinning everyday?

Explain to me how the Holy Spirit will leave the body and the demon will return with 7 more worse than it is, if you can't lose your salvation. Pray tell why would God not put more temptation on you than you can stand if he wouldn't take your salvation away. Why did Jesus say go and sin no more? That is exactly what He meant. He said to "Repent", not continue in sin.

You can be forgiven of any sin on this world except Blasphemy the Holy Ghost. You can curse God and Jesus or even murder a little child and be forgiven, but you only get one opportunity to be saved. If you throw it away by continually sinning, your sins are no longer forgiven.

Take the Homosexuals for example, since that is the main gripe of some of you:

Let's say a Homosexual asks God to forgive him. You would agree that God would forgive him, BUT if he continued to live with or even marry another man, even though it is a forgivable sin, you keep saying that the Homosexual will lose his salvation because you say he is going to hell. How can that be if once you are saved you never lose your salvation?

You are preaching with a forked tongue!

All that needs to be said is "the bible says Homosexuals will not be allowed in heaven because it is a sin and anyone who continues to sin after being born again loses the right to go to heaven".

Since it applies to Homosexuals it applies to all born again Christians who continue to sin.

I didn't write it I only read it. Sin is Sin! That is all that needs to be said about it. You can all live the way you want to and believe the way you want to. Only time will tell. I pray I am wrong, but no one can seem to change my understanding. There are too many verses in the bible that agree with this.

If you accept the mark of the beast, you will lose your salvation.

Posted by Unique-Lies on Mon, Dec 1, 2008, at 12:19 PM

Unique-Lies,

If you accept the mark of the beast, you didn't have a salvation to lose.

This is your Trials and Tribulation of the Anti-Christ. Since no one is Raptured up before this takes place except the 144,000, there will be anger and cursing and screaming and pain.

Posted by Unique-Lies on Mon, Dec 1, 2008, at 2:31 PM

Unique-Lies,

That is indeed almost your unique perspective of the rapture and the 144,000.

You amaze me at how tough you sound now, but if the anti-christ's henchmen are threatening to cut your granddaughters throat if you don't accept the mark... and that is after they have tortured you and killed your wife.

But you are a strong flesh and blood that has everlasting salvation and a love that will make you immune to all this hate and destruction of human lives. I hope I am dead when all this happens. I am just a weak old man. My heart couldn't take all this torture around me!

-- Posted by Unique-Lies on Mon, Dec 1, 2008, at 2:31 PM

Unique-Lies,

There is nothing for anyone to be tough about. Instead it takes faith. We are told to take no thought nor premeditate beforehand what we shall say but rely instead that it will be given to us what we will say and do when we are delivered up. The Holy Ghost is promised to enable us. It is the same Holy Ghost that brings peace and assurance to souls today when they are immersed into Him. It is the same Holy Ghost that will calm your night terrors of fearing the Christ into a hopeful and joyous expectant return of Him which you will yearn for. I have to rely on those promises and also knowing that to lose a worldly life here is gain an eternal life there.

I am going to bed and get a good nights sleep. I trust in the promises.

I think we would all be interested in the 10 most popular and different categories you have placed Homosexuals in. Do you judge each one according to the class or responses, as you put it, they are in or do you judge them all as one group?

Posted by Unique-Lies on Mon, Dec 1, 2008, at 9:44 PM

Unique-Lies,

Let's try to get you straightened out on this little matter first. It is no wonder that if reading my little post gets you tangled up that you have so much problem with getting the Book of Revelation mixed up as you do.

My question never had anything to do with "10 different catagories" I have placed homosexuals in or judge them by. That statement is simply a figment of your imagination again. I have not placed them in any categories or rankings. I think rather you simply are one or you are not one. The reference to 10 was made in telling you that there was so many opinions as to what this word homosexual means to different people in the context you used it.

Again, the question was what does the word homosexual mean when used in the context of "your" statement that said...."the bible says Homosexuals will not be allowed in heaven". I asked you to tell me what the word homosexual means in "your" statement that "you" made. I am wanting you to tell me what criteria must be met to be labeled as the homosexual in "your" statement.

You used the word homosexual in "your" statement so tell us what it means to "you". You disqualified a lot of people from heaven with your generalized statement. Be more specific and define this word you used so a lot of people will not fear being lumped into your generalization.

1 - Were you referring to anyone who might be only genetically marked with the gene and never had a sexual relationship with a person of the same sex?

2 - Were you referring to anyone who had one sexual relationship with a person of the same sex?

3 - Were you referring to anyone who had been raped by a person of the same sex?

4 - Were you referring to anyone who had sexual relationships on a regular basis with a person of the same sex?

5 - Were you referring to anyone who had only the thought or desire but never committed the act?

6 - Were you referring to anyone who had a thought of it after they were saved?

7 - Were you referring to anyone who was tempted after salvation and fell for it?

8 - Were you referring to anyone who thought it was wrong and it was a sin but still had thoughts and desires of it?

9 - Were you referring to anyone who thought it was wrong and a sin and desired to be free of it but still had temptations and had fallen into an act of it?

10 - Were you referring to anyone who thought it was right and not a sin but never had thoughts nor acts of it?

Which of the above are you saying would not be allowed in heaven? I think some of the above could actually be in repentance and not meet the criteria of the way you used the word homosexual in disqualifying people. In particular look at #9 and #10. In my opinion # 10 is more suitable to be used for the word homosexual than #9 in the context you used the word. But that is just the way I see things. Now, what is your opinion?

parkerbrothers,

-> You used the word homosexual in "your" statement so tell us what it means to "you". You disqualified a lot of people from heaven with your generalized statement. Be more specific and define this word you used so a lot of people will not fear being lumped into your generalization.

Parkerbrothers, with all your hatred towards Homosexuality, You sure have put a lot of love and concern into your obsession with Homosexuals. You did leave out an 11th category.

Generic Answer:

James 4:17 Anyone, then, who knows the good he ought to do and doesn't do it, sins.

1 Corinthians 6:9 Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders

10 nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.

Romans 1:26-27 - 26 Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones.

27 In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion.

Revelation 21:27 And there shall in no wise enter into it [Kingdom of God] any thing that defileth, neither whatsoever worketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life.

1 - Were you referring to anyone who might be only genetically marked with the gene and never had a sexual relationship with a person of the same sex?

--> I read the Bible, but that doesn't make me an ordained minister of any particular faith. I have study the law in the USA, but that doesn't make me a lawyer. I have a little bit of Irish and German in me, but that doesn't make me Irish nor a German. We are told that we inherit our father's sins, but until we act on them we are not the sinner of whatever sins they are.

2 - Were you referring to anyone who had one sexual relationship with a person of the same sex?

James 4:17 Anyone, then, who knows the good he ought to do and doesn't do it, sins.

Therefore they must repent/be reborn and never do it again to inherit the kingdom of God.

3 - Were you referring to anyone who had been raped by a person of the same sex?

Are you really that sick to call a victim of a heinous crime a homosexual?

Matthew 5:44 But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;

4 - Were you referring to anyone who had sexual relationships on a regular basis with a person of the same sex?

Romans 1:27 In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion.

Revelation 21:27 And there shall in no wise enter into it [Kingdom of God] any thing that defileth, neither whatsoever worketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life.

5 - Were you referring to anyone who had only the thought or desire but never committed the act?

James 1:14-16 - 14 But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.

15 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.

16 Do not err, my beloved brethren.

6 - Were you referring to anyone who had a thought of it after they were saved?

James 1:14-16 - 14 But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.

15 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.

16 Do not err, my beloved brethren.

7 - Were you referring to anyone who was tempted after salvation and fell for it?

Hebrews 6:4-6 - 4 For [it is] impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,

5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,

6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put [him] to an open shame. 8 - Were you referring to anyone who thought it was wrong and it was a sin but still had thoughts and desires of it?

9 - Were you referring to anyone who thought it was wrong and a sin and desired to be free of it but still had temptations and had fallen into an act of it?

If they were born again, See answer above and Generic Answer above. If they had never been born again then they can be forgiven and enter into the Kingdom of God if they never return to the act.

10 - Were you referring to anyone who thought it was right and not a sin but never had thoughts nor acts of it?

How could this person not have thoughts about it if he thought it was right?

The correct answer would be if he thought it was right, he was lusting about it even thou he never did it, which is a sin. Everyone knows deep down that it is wrong! However since he never continued to think about it anymore, he has not lusted so he has no longer continued in lusting, but has to be forgiven and born again to enter into the Kingdom of God.

Revelation 21:27 And there shall in no wise enter into it [Kingdom of God] any thing that defileth, neither whatsoever worketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life.

don't forget this one!

11 - was I referring to anyone who never read or heard of the word of God and never knew it was wrong, and they did it and continued doing it?

Males (young and old) know that it is wrong without reading the scriptures. They may be weak minded and agree, but they know it isn't normal in our society.

The secret is to seek Jesus and get born again and never repeat the sin.

Let me add that I think #9 is in repentance but #10 has never repented or changed his mind about homosexuality.

I believe #9 knows he is sick and I believe Christ will heal him of his sickness with a new body in heaven after he leaves this tent of flesh.

-- Posted by parkerbrothers on Tue, Dec 2, 2008, at 9:19 AM

-> #9 in no way reads like a person in repentance. If he knows it was wrong and a sin and is tempted to do it again and has fallen into an act of it, but desires to be free from it, He has the possibilities of becoming free and inheriting the Kingdom of God. However, first he must repent and be born again to enter the kingdom of God. By being born again the temptation will flee.

In summary, any man who enters into any sexual acts with another man is engaging in Homosexuality and is heading for the lake of fire. If they have never been born again they can repent and be forgiven. Once they are forgiven and continue to engage in sexual activities with men, their sins are no longer forgiven.(Hebrews 6:4-6)

See how easy it was for me to answer your dumbfounded questions? Yet you have never answered any of my questioned I gave you to answer. You can not answer them with the scriptures.

Therefore they must repent/be reborn and never do it again to inherit the kingdom of God.

Posted by Unique-Lies on Tue, Dec 2, 2008, at 1:51 PM

Unique-Lies,

There you go tuning things up again. Adding a little unique to it.

Never read that in the Bible nor have I met anybody that thought that way. (until you)

However, first he must repent and be born again to enter the kingdom of God. By being born again the temptation will flee.

Posted by Unique-Lies on Tue, Dec 2, 2008, at 1:51 PM

Unique-Lies,

You said you were born again but the temptation of yours did not flee?

Why would his be any different?

In summary, any man who enters into any sexual acts with another man is engaging in Homosexuality and is heading for the lake of fire. If they have never been born again they can repent and be forgiven. Once they are forgiven and continue to engage in sexual activities with men, their sins are no longer forgiven.(Hebrews 6:4-6)

See how easy it was for me to answer your dumbfounded questions? Yet you have never answered any of my questioned I gave you to answer. You can not answer them with the scriptures.

-- Posted by Unique-Lies on Tue, Dec 2, 2008, at 1:51 PM

Unique-Lies,

Again you give good reason to postpone salvation to the last possible minute you are comfortable gambling with. You almost turn it into a crap shoot. Every day someone got up they would have to weigh the odds on them living another day against the likelyhood of ever sinning again. According to you would not you have been better to have gambled and waited several years until now. Even if you had of waited what would the gamble be like tommorrow. That scenerio is almost like having to wonder on the odds of your head chopper saving you before you die of natural causes? What is the odds he is coming to your rescue?

And no you never answered my question because you never understood what the question was.

And yes I answered all your questions and they still are in the archives for your review. Most were answered multiple times.

parkerbrothers,

Therefore they must repent/be reborn and never do it again to inherit the kingdom of God.

Never read that in the Bible nor have I met anybody that thought that way. (until you)

-- Posted by parkerbrothers on Tue, Dec 2, 2008, at 2:56 PM

Yeah, I know! What a shame that is to confess you know Jesus and have never known his word.

We must feel remorse for our sins, then ask Jesus to come into our lives and take control. We must then let Jesus take control of our bodies, our mind and our soul. This is how we don't sin again. The Holy Spirit has taken control over us and lead us away from sin. To be absent in the body is to be present with the Lord.

2 Corinthians 5:6-11;17-18

6 Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord:

7 (For we walk by faith, not by sight:)

8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.

9 Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him.

10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.

11 Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences.

17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.

18 And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;

I have only quoted bible scriptures on this and you just can't accept it.

Jesus said to "go and sin no more." Jesus didn't say go and sin all you want to because you have been saved forever. Jesus died once for everyone and everyone better accept that as a onetime salvation.

1 Corinthians 10:6-13;21

6 Now these things occurred as examples[a] to keep us from setting our hearts on evil things as they did.

7 Do not be idolaters, as some of them were; as it is written: "The people sat down to eat and drink and got up to indulge in pagan revelry."

8 We should not commit sexual immorality, as some of them did--and in one day twenty-three thousand of them died.

9 We should not test the Lord, as some of them did--and were killed by snakes.

10 And do not grumble, as some of them did--and were killed by the destroying angel.

11 These things happened to them as examples and were written down as warnings for us, on whom the fulfillment of the ages has come.

12 So, if you think you are standing firm, be careful that you don't fall!

13 No temptation has seized you except what is common to man. And God is faithful; he will not let you be tempted beyond what you can bear. But when you are tempted, he will also provide a way out so that you can stand up under it.

21Ye cannot drink the cup of the Lord, and the cup of devils: ye cannot be partakers of the Lord's table, and of the table of devils

Yes, a preacher does all those things, but he also has to warn of oncoming doom and trials and tribulations.

A preacher whose flock is always comfortable and non-caring never sees the wolf coming.

A preacher has to be loving but firm, sensitive, but not scared to step on a few toes or to offend someone every now and then.

False prophets?? Here's your example. A simple, may God bless you and forgive you would be sufficient. "I will pray for you" are the most comforting and powerful words a true believer needs.

Posted by starparent on Tue, Dec 2, 2008, at 7:52 PM

starparent,

I trust that Paul was a true believer. He had a somewhat different approach than what you described, even over a simple manner of assembly of the dinner table, let alone a false doctrine of a fragile one chance, one shot temporary salvation as uniquelies spews forth.

Galatians 2

11But when Peter was come to Antioch, I withstood him to the face, because he was to be blamed.

12For before that certain came from James, he did eat with the Gentiles: but when they were come, he withdrew and separated himself, fearing them which were of the circumcision.

13And the other Jews dissembled likewise with him; insomuch that Barnabas also was carried away with their dissimulation.

14But when I saw that they walked not uprightly according to the truth of the gospel, I said unto Peter before them all, If thou, being a Jew, livest after the manner of Gentiles, and not as do the Jews, why compellest thou the Gentiles to live as do the Jews?

15We who are Jews by nature, and not sinners of the Gentiles,

16Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

17But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ, we ourselves also are found sinners, is therefore Christ the minister of sin? God forbid.

18For if I build again the things which I destroyed, I make myself a transgressor.

19For I through the law am dead to the law, that I might live unto God.

20I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

21I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

Unique,

Study the last sentence of verse 25 above. You will see where true repentance occurs.

As long as we are draped in this tent of flesh no man will ever be able to bring his body into full repentance. Even James realized one of the smallest members of it, the tongue, can not be tamed. The body will always have its desires of lust warring with the mind that wants to serve God.

Repentance is possible of the mind.

As I said earlier it is my belief that a person can be truly repentant of his lustful desires (homosexuality) by having a change of mind but will probably still struggle with his sin. He may even stumble and fall but he will be remorseful.

Only an unrepentant man would claim that homosexuality is not a sin. I may be wrong but I believe that anyone who does not view homosexuality as being wrong might very well meet the definition of being a homosexual in the context you used the word, irregaurdless of their own personal involvement with it. In other words, if you are not against it, you are for it. If you are for it, you are a homosexual. Jesus made it quite clear that you did not have to actually do the sin to be guilty of it.

Unique-Lies,

As usual you miss the point.

It all leads back to what is being called a homosexual in the context that you said...."the bible says Homosexuals will not be allowed in heaven".

I have been trying to get you to think about what that word means.

Let me put in another way by using an old phrase I have heard. "There are a lot of virgins who are whores". With this phrase you have to wonder how could a virgin be a whore. You have to understand the point at which she becomes a whore. It is not an actual act that makes her a whore. It is an attitude or belief.

You want to focus so much on the actual physical act that you miss the whole point.

Many men and women are adulterers and adultresses and have never had an extramarital affair.

In summary I have been trying to get you to see the real definition of a homosexual in the context you used it. It is still my belief that a man can be a homosexual and never physically committed a homosexual act and likewise I believe someone can have a homosexual act and not be a homosexual in the context you used the word.

parkerbrothers

A man who thinks about being a homosexual or thinks of the act, would be doing it in his mind and heart so he would be a homosexual in God's eyes.

However, if a man engages in a homosexual act, he has committed the sin and is therefore not going into the kingdom of heaven.

If he gets saved and doesn't do it again... no, but if he does it again... he has committed the act again and is not going into the kingdom of heaven. He would have to be forgiven again.

You are saying that if he was once saved, he can have all the homosexual experiences he wants to as long as he repents each time and asks to be forgiven again. That is not repentance, but just an excuse for doing what he done again.

The same holds true with the man who doesn't do it but wants to. He is just as much a sinner as the homosexual and will not go to the kingdom of heaven.

I still say that homosexuality is a sin and anyone who engages in it or wants to is not going to heaven. But because God has hardened the hearts of all the people in the last generation, we are destined to continue on as we are unless God intervenes, so we must accept what people chose for themselves even if it is wrong according to the bible. You can preach to them all you want to but they won't listen unless God sends them to you to save. By preaching to them without their consent is just harassing them and reminding them that they are committing a sin ( The very thing Jesus gave us the 2 commandments for... so we would not to be reminded of all our sins because we are not under the law of sin).

My father would ask me when I was a small boy, "If your friend jumped off a cliff, would you jump off too?" If we have learned any common sense, we would know what to do and not do. If we know something is a sin, we know not to follow anyone in the sin. Homosexuals like Prostitutes will be around when Christ returns. They have just always been and will always be. God destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah because of the Lust of man, but that never ended Prostitution nor Homosexuality nor anything else man lusts for.

It will always be here, even thou they are wrong, they are sins and in most States unlawful.

No Preacher, Policeman, FBI Agent, CSI Agent, NCISCCC?? Agent, Judge, Jury, Governor, Senator, Congressman nor the IRS will ever get Prostitution and Homosexuality off the streets in America, and if they do, there are over countries.

So, do what you want, I am through with the subject. If you can convert one or even two, God Bless you!

Adultery, homosexuality, stealing, etc.,etc. are not defined by an act in Gods eyes.

Typo error: Insert the word "only" in between not and defined.

Should have read:

Adultery, homosexuality, stealing, etc.,etc. are not only defined by an act in Gods eyes.

parkerbrothers,

We are born of this world. We are raised according to this world. We ARE of this world.

This is what Paul was referring to when he said we are present in the body but absent from the Lord.

Our body is the temple of God. It is void of God until God blesses us with his grace. We then search for Christ to fill the emptiness in our lives.

When we finally find Christ and accept him we are born again. That means we invite Jesus to come in and take control over our lives. We turn everything over to Jesus because we can do nothing without Christ but thru Christ all things are possible.

At this point, Jesus comes in and sweeps out our temple and makes it ready for the Holy Ghost to live in. This is the spirit that returns to God when we die. This Spirit, the Holy Ghost, is God. That is why the bible tells us that when we are born again, He who is in us is greater than he who is in the world. The bible also says God is within us. We are one with God.

Now, everything changes. We are no longer of the world but living in Christ. When we were living in the world we were living in sin and we were present in the body (living according to the world and lusting in the body) and absent from the Lord.

But now, we changed all that. We are now Present with the Lord and absent in the body because we don't lust for worldly things.

Althou we are still in our bodies, we worship God and try to do his will. The Holy Spirit is inside of us guiding us in righteous things and not sinful ways.

God can not be tempted nor can he tempt us. We tempt ourselves with our bodies. God will not allow more temptation to fall upon us than we can turn away from. "Resist the devil and he will flee." If we don't turn from the temptation, we will backslide. When God is within you, you will block out the evil thoughts and not do anything against God's will. Not intentionally anyway. We all make bad judgments but if we know it is wrong, we won't do it. God keeps the desires down to where you can control them as long as you stay in his word. If you turn from God you will sin.

When I accepted Christ, I was reading his word and looking for answers to prove the bible wrong. All of a sudden, Jesus came in and I knew it. Everything lifted from my shoulders. I was a free man from all my sins. I just knew I was forgiven, no question about it. I also knew that I had no more desire to sin.

Being in my early twenties and ready to disprove anything I could, I had to test this new feeling that I have never experienced before. I literally made myself sin! I lost the feeling as quickly as I received it. I have never received such joy and pleasure since then. I have prayed and asked for forgiveness for years, but nothing! Then I read Hebrews and knew why. If only I had read Hebrews first or was not so bullheaded after I came out of the service. Irregardless, I have read his word faithfully every since I was in my early twenties and still looking for answers. And still bullheaded.

Over the years I have lied, stolen, fornicated, committed adultery, cheated, hated my enemies and lusted for things that weren't mine. According to the scriptures I should be a devil or at least one of his angels, but not an anti-christ.

However, since I was born again, I am under the grace of God not the laws. I am bound by two commandments; Love God with all my heart, mind and soul and to love my neighbor as myself. All of the above crimes/sins are not part of the two commandments, so therefore they are not applicable. There are no laws nor sins listed in the two commandments so sins are nonexistent. If there are no sins, I can not sin, therefore I don't need forgiveness for salvation which Jesus has already given to me.

People in the old testament were forgiven for serious crimes or sins over and over again because they could sacrifice an animal for their sins and they would also be forgiven when Jesus went to hell.

Moses and Aaron weren't so lucky. They didn't get to go into the promised land because of their sin against God. Althou I'm sure God has forgiven them because of Jesus' sacrifice.

So, should I believe Jesus or whoever wrote the book of Hebrews? I think I will Choose Jesus.

Thank you parkerbrothers for you persistence.

parkerbrothers,

I meant it. As I stated earlier, God has hidden the truth in his word. The Holy Ghost will have to reveal the true answer to someone eventually. When the bible has conflicting verses there is usually a reason. I just can't find it nor understand why it exist, but it does.

If we are under the grace of God and not under the Law, we are not bound by any list of sins either, only the two commandments which tells us to love God with all our heart, mind and soul and our neighbor as ourselves.

If we are under the grace of God and not under the Law, we are not bound by any list of sins either, only the two commandments which tells us to love God with all our heart, mind and soul and our neighbor as ourselves.

Posted by Unique-Lies on Wed, Dec 10, 2008, at 12:27 AM

Unique-Lies,

That is another portion that caused me great grief trying to understand and reconcile and still to this day makes me want to study further to come into more light. The following verses were ones that somewhat relate to your post and generated this desire for me to study further.

Colossians 2: 13-14

13And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;

14Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;