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Where is our state's "stimulus" money going?Posted Tuesday, November 17, 2009, at 4:33 PM
According to www.recovery.gov it's been going to congressional districts that don't even exist.
I'm not even going to get into the national implications of this, let's stick to just our state. Tennessee has nine congressional districts. They are, appropriately labeled one, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight, and nine. According to www.recovery.gov "the U.S. government's official website providing easy access to data related to Recovery Act spending and allows for the reporting of potential fraud, waste, and abuse.", they have sent money to those districts as well as districts 00, 11, 13, 14, 29, 32, and 47. Can anybody explain to me where the 28 jobs that were created in these imaginary districts are? Are real people performing these jobs or are these fairies, nymphs, gnomes, and leprechauns that were hired at the expense of the taxpayers? Good thing we had that whole stimulus thing or these folks (or mythical creatures) wouldn't have jobs. At least we got 102.1 jobs in the 6th district. Hmm...who's doing the ten percent of a job? That one must be a federal government job. Comments Showing comments in chronological order [Show most recent comments first] |
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Yes I too see the same information on recovery.gov. I think the explanation is rather benign though. The information was probably keyed in using some type of data collection form. When the local individuals responsible for performing this task keyed in the data they mistakenly entered their local Tennessee House District instead of the United States House District. Garbage in, garbage out.
I picked one of the congressional districts and attempted to follow the money. If I am to undertand Nathans explanation, which may or may not be correct, it should be easy to prove. According to the recovery.gov web site the 5th house district received $1,333,851,875 and created 7,606 jobs. The 5th district is Unicoi and part of Green county up in east TN and is served by David C. Hawk. According to the county's chamber of commerce there are only 17,709 people living in the county. I have not be up to this part of east TN, but do know it is mountainous, and small towns, not large cities, so where did the over 7,000 jobs come from? I picked this randomly from the recovery.gov site, it was the first one on the list. If I have a misunderstanding of the numbers I am very willing to listen to a further explanation.
Maybe GIGO should stand for Government in, Garbage out.
Sharon22, Tennessee's US House District 5 is Nashville. Not all of the people that submitted the information made a mistake, only a few.
Nathan,
My next question would be - How do you confuse your US house district with your TN house district? I do understand US House District 5 is Nashville, but someone has really messed up if they think we have all those US house districts. I was just trying to prove a point if someone "mixed up" districts as you explained, Unicoi county is quite a distance from Davidson county.
Surely you have noticed a level of incompetence in America that can be seen where you work, on tv (Jaywalking is a great example), and in our schools (see recent local school report cards). One very noticeable example that comes to my mind is the amount of spelling errors that I see in comments on this site. Now I don't think that misspelling words indicates one's intelligence, but the same person that would post a comment for all to read and not spend a little time ensuring that they did not come across as incompetent, is the same type of person that would enter a state house district number that they incorrectly googled. Basically this type person just wants to get the job done and is not concerned with attention to detail. Looking back at the reports I do see that recipient reported data is included in the results, so chances are some people made some mistakes.
So, we have an incompetent White House staff sending money to incompentent state government officials? That will make me sleep much sounder tonight!:)
Sharon22 - Please tell me that's not news to you.
No Thom, it's not news, still trying to prove a point.
Another question that I've wondered about is this.
If the "stimulus" was such important, do or die, legislation that we had to have passed immediately and couldn't do without, why has so little of the money for this bill been allocated so far? If the government got us out of this recession by spending the stimulus money, then couldn't they have done this sooner if they had spent all of our money, rather than sitting on it?
The more important question would be - Why has the jobless rate gone UP since all our money has been spent?
I'm really not trying to get into all this, but only a very small percentage of the stimulus has been spent thus far Sharon. Most of the money will be appropriated throughout 2010, 2011, and 2012.
Joe Biden was on the Daily Show tonight and he basically confirmed that some of the reports submitted by the recipients contained state congressional districts or districts that did not exist.
If incompetency is a criterion for having important jobs nowadays,I think some of us are being overlooked and underutilized.
Such standards would explain why so many intelligent,workbrittle and responsible folk are unemployed or working beneathe their potential.
But,it still doesn't answer why so many necessary tasks go undone while we have unskilled and unmotivated people to put in charge.
Maybe,the shadow government we hear so much about has hired its own wraiths,poltergeists and other Apparition Americans to take on equally intangible projects.
Or,perhaps,while other small towns are looking to get Gitmo prisoners,Tennessee is providing towns that don't exist in districts that don't exist for people who don't exist.
(visions of Patrick McGoohan as Prisoner #6 flash before me along with Bruce Greenwood as Thomas Veil the "Nowhere Man.")
Maybe,Area 51 is a little larger than we think and closer than we suspect.
With all the hassles that came about when brown people and black people showed up to process pencils and chickens,can you blame the Powers-That -Be if they want plausible deniability should gray aliens sign on to manufacture vaporware?
I'm really not trying to get into all this, but only a very small percentage of the stimulus has been spent thus far Sharon. Most of the money will be appropriated throughout 2010, 2011, and 2012.
-- Posted by nathan.evans
Yet the administration is claiming that the stimulus package worked, so why not cancel the rest if the spending? It would seem wasteful and unnecessary now.
I am going to make one more attempt to follow some money and logic. TN house district 29 is in Chattanooga (JoAnne Favors, D), we have no US house number that high. The US house district for that region is district 3 (Zach Wamp, R). Whom do you suggest I contact to see where the level of incompetence exist? The "29th" district received over $9.6 and created 20 jobs. The numbers make sense for Chattanooga, but some government officials education is lacking if they don't know the difference of state and federal representatives.
Sharon Yoi still don't seem to get it. The recipients are more than just government officials. Click on the dots on the map and you will discover that some of the people submitting the results are HVAC installers and paving companies among others. Stop hating all things government for five minutes and you might realize that spending billions of dollars in Tennessee is far more beneficial to America than spending billions of dollars in Iraq or Afghanistan.
Nathan,
Where along the way did I say I was hating anyone? I have looked at the dots and personally if I had a HVAC installer that can't fill out a form properly I'm not sure I would want him/her installing a HVAV unit at my house. Now, am I saying I hate HVAC installers? I don't think so. I just want MY money in MY pocket so I can decide where and what to spend it on, after all I am the one that worked to earn, and at a job I have to be proved competent on at least annually.
Sharon,
Our district house number is 62 ...
EM,
Would that be state, federal or other?
state
The US ranks 19th down from 18th for corruption.
New Zealand is the least corrupt being no.1 and
Somolia is the most corrupt being no.180. I wonder how far we'll drop by the time this presidents 4 years are over.
I don't see how you could get anymore transparent government! The Obama administration has put a website out there that gives you the names of the companies and service providers that have received stimulus funds, what the money is being used for, and how many employees the employer says they employed as a result. Somehow you still gripe and cry about corruption. Your paranoia is extreme, but I should expect that from a group of individuals that think Glenn Beck and Sean Hannity speak truth. Amazingly you feel comfortable changing America because of the actions of a few hijackers whose main goal was to change America forever. I don't understand this fear that has taken control of your thought processes. I find it sad and pathetic that you ignore logic and reason and instead opt for fear and paranoia. Have some faith in your fellow man and the United States for crying out loud! It isn't Obama that is destroying America, it is you.
bellbuckletn,
The CPI has been floating around 7.1 to 7.8 since 2001 one, it was better before 2001... Hmm wonder who was in office 2001-2009?
The CPI has been floating around 7.1 to 7.8 since 2001 one, it was better before 2001... Hmm wonder who was in office 2001-2009?
-- Posted by Evil Monkey
Because nothing happened toward the end of 2001 that affected the economy. (rolleyes)
Dear Mr. Williamson:
Somehow, I thought you knew: we gave ignorance a vote and, Washington gave them our money!
Nathan,
Your are barking up the wrong tree with me since I don't listen to either Sean Hannity or Glen Beck. I am still trying to understand the logic behind a government web site that published false information. At my place of employment that receives a fair share of it's revenue from the government (Medicare), we receive NO payment when the wrong information is filed.
It isn't Obama that is destroying America, it is you.
-- Posted by nathan.evans on Wed, Nov 18, 2009, at 11:05 AM Look in the mirror when you say that.
"Your are barking up the wrong tree with me since I don't listen to either Sean Hannity or Glen Beck."
That doesn't matter to some people. If you don't like the current administration then you're either a racist, listen to Rush, Hannity, Beck, or Ingram; or all of the above. It's not that you can take in information and form your own opinion.
Nathan - get off your high-horse and debate rather than trying to start an argument. You could have made your point by simply stating that there's a possibility that we'll move up on the list, and that you think we will. Nope, you've got to immediately go to arguing. Get a grip...really.
That is such a load of bull Thom. I am not starting anything with anyone. I am only stating my opinion that a lot of you guys are paranoid and controlled by fear. You get a grip.
Yes Nathan, I realize you are only stating your opinion, as I am mine. I, as of yet to read of anyone on this blog that sounds paranoid or controlled by fear. I have had some fun since last night seeing you going around in circles and still not answer my basic question, which would actually be - Where does the accountability lie for this mistakes on the recovery.gov web site? Does it lie with the White House and it's web masters, or does it lie with the folks who sent in the initial applications and no follow up was done? My opinion would be that it lies with all of the above, but no one really wants to take responsibility. I will go back to something I have stated several times on various blogs and that is of personal responsibility. It is not the FEDERAL governments responsiblity to take care of my health care, educating our children, supplement my housing or my vehicles. It is part of the FEDERAL governments responsiblity to protect us via the military. I would love to see us out of Iraq and Afganistan, also out of Germany, Japan, England or any other country we have a base in. Is any of that likely to happen, I don't think so. I would like to see our country become the United STATES of America again and lets the states take responsibility for each of its own state. Our federal legislator's should each hold a job outside their elected job and become a part-time legislator, with NO benefits. But, then again, these are just my opinion. What other opinions might exist out there.
"Your paranoia is extreme, but I should expect that from a group of individuals that think Glenn Beck and Sean Hannity speak truth. Amazingly you feel comfortable changing America because of the actions of a few hijackers whose main goal was to change America forever. I don't understand this fear that has taken control of your thought processes. I find it sad and pathetic that you ignore logic and reason and instead opt for fear and paranoia. Have some faith in your fellow man and the United States for crying out loud! It isn't Obama that is destroying America, it is you."
Nathan - You're right, what could possibly be confrontational about calling someone paranoid, saying it's "sad and pathetic" that they are illogical and unreasonable, and saying that THEY are destroying America? I must have misunderstood that because obviously you meant that as a bit of constructive criticism.
I must have misunderstood that because obviously you meant that as a bit of constructive criticism.
-- Posted by Thom on Thu, Nov 19, 2009, at 9:10 AM
Indeed!
I watched the episode with Joe Biden and he explained that the recipients of the money were not trained properly when they had to submit the information to the website. Hence the unusual district number readings.
At least we have an understanding of where these funds are going. Even though not perfect, this is better than back a few years ago, when $12 billion was lost without a trace in Iraq.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2007/feb...
sharron22, you stated you just want your money in your pocket to spend how you want, tell me how much of that money would you volunteer to pay to cover the cost of the public services you use. Things such as police protection, roads , schools, fire department to name just a few.
You said it not up to the government to care for certain areas, but tell me this should you lose your job and are unable to find one that pays well enough to afford you all the basics needed to get by ( food, health care, housing and so forth) will you live on the street, go hungry and die for lack of medical care or will you apply for assistance? Would you refuse unemployment ?
I find that a lot of people talk big talk about personal responsibility, and run down those who have hit bottom and need help, generally those doing the talking have good jobs and do not see themselves as ever being in the position of those they look down their noses at. Yet if they step back their political high horses they will see that many of those on assistance are people just like them who at some point in their past never expected to have the rug pulled out from under their lives. They felt every bit as secure at some point in their lives.
It easy to talk big and judge others when everything seems mostly secure in our lives, but don't be fooled not one of us are too good or untouchable from disaster, anyone of us could be the next to lose all we have.
Wonderwhy,
For me, and I expect lots of others, I would be very willing to help someone who has fallen on hard times and needs help. As long as they were willing to help themselves as well. It would be much easier for the average taxpayer to be able to help those people if 40-60% of their pay wasn't being confiscated by the government. The average taxpayer would probably be a much better steward of their money than is the government.
However, a certain unnamed political party has as it's bread and butter, creating and maintaining a social and economic underclass whom they can pander to and convince that "other people" are evil and should be punished by stealing their possessions (we'll call it progressive taxation).
Lowering taxes on businesses would also free up revenue for hiring more employees, upgrading equipment, or expanding product lines-all of which create jobs and stimulate the economy.
Nathan - That was sarcasm...perhaps you've heard of this?
Wonderwhy,
If you would have read it closely, I said the FEDERAL government needs to stick to what it was originally intended to do and that is basically protecting us. I am not opposed to the states assisting people or a properly run state welfare program. I am also with quietmike, I am very willing to help others that have fallen on hard times, but we sometimes are need as willing when such a large portion our paychecks are going to the FEDERAL government. Since I live out in the country, my fire protection is volunteer and highly relies on fund raisers, which I am very willing to assist with. I am not opposed to local government property and/or sales taxes going toward schools, roads and police.
A good portion of the population is 1-3 paychecks away from being in finacial difficulty. Would I refuse unemployment, doubt at this point I would qualify. I am in a such a profession that there would be a job out there for me, and yes, it may not be what I choose to do, but it would pay the bills.
I am a firm believer in giving a person a hand-up and not a hand out. We need to look outside the box to often change our circumstances, and not be confined or restrained because of our circumstances.
EM,
You have given the most plausable explanation, for which I would have to agree. Do you or does anyone know how these application were submitted, were they computer applications or printed. My main reason for asking is, if they were computer generated I lay fault at the programmers feet. I know that a default could have been placed within the program listing the correct districts and we would not even be having this discussion. I have applied for certain things online and have an address with a zip code that splits between 2 counties, and more often than not it will ask me which county I live in. This is an example of the type of default that could have been placed with an online computer application.
You have given the most plausable explanation, for which I would have to agree.
-- Posted by Sharon22 on Thu, Nov 19, 2009, at 7:52 PM
It was the same explanation I gave you a day before!
Nathan,
You said they were incompetent, big difference from not being properly trained!
If someone is not properly trained they are said to be _________?
"In need of education" I guess you are incompetent when you don't know how to work a new computer program! So that must make you incompetent to work on computers.
Your logic processor is broken.
No, just having fun getting your goat.
We know that government is definitely not perfect no matter who is in charge . . . the problem is that Obama's administration promised that there would be oversight and extreme scrutiny over how the stimulus money was going to be spent and that it was going to be spent right but we are not seeing that.
Examples:
In Oklahoma, recovery.gov lists more than $19 million in spending -- and 15 jobs created -- in yet more congressional districts that don't exist.
In Iowa, it shows $10.6 million spent -- and 39 jobs created -- in nonexistent districts.
In Connecticut's 42nd district (which also does not exist), the Web site claims 25 jobs created with zero stimulus dollars.
The list of spending and job creation in fictional congressional districts extends to U.S. territories as well.
$68.3 million spent and 72.2 million spent in the 1st congressional district of the U.S. Virgin Islands.
$8.4 million spent and 40.3 jobs created in the 99th congressional district of the U.S. Virgin Islands.
$1.5 million spent and .3 jobs created in the 69th district and $35 million for 142 jobs in the 99th district of the Northern Mariana Islands.
$47.7 million spent and 291 jobs created in Puerto Rico's 99th congressional district. Interesting facts and figures, but none of these districts exist
Yes, and in Iraq under the Bush Adminstraton, $12 billion was brought there in bales of $100 bills, and properly thrown away.
And the Bush administration has been over for TEN MONTHS, yet you people continue to complain about it. Talk about beating a dead horse. There is absolutely nothing that can be changed about the Bush administration. Just because they screwed things up doesn't mean that we have to put up with the same ineptitude from the Obama administration.
Exactly . . . I thought we were going to see change and accountability and fiscal responsibility but all we are just seeing is the same spending habits of the previous administration.
Grit . . . your comparison is old and stale and needs to be thrown out like last year's underwear. Why not blame George Washington while we are at it? I mean really . . . broken records are never fun to listen to.
jaxspike.... due to the George W's adm/policy down fall of our economy, I am still wearing last year's underwear. I can not afford new underwear. LOL
The buck may stop at the presidents desk but it starts at congress. We need to lay part the blame at congress, and I don't really care if there is an D or an R after there name.
The cry of OOPS! from the Obama supporters is getting louder every day! Thus far, our new "transparent and accountable" administration has spent about $334,000.00 for every job they have supposedly created and more than 3.4 million people have lost their jobs since the stimulus bill was passed. There's no other explanation for this than outright incompetence. Joseph Biden himself tried to warn Americans of Obama's inexperience, but the kool-aid drinkers just wanted to make "history".
I would like to see the math you used to make that assertion T&S.
The only "OOPS" that is needed is from those who dismiss disastrous policies of Bush and Co. as being old news... (even though 8 years of incompetence is the reason we are dealing with what we have now), yet still find it within themselves to go even further back to Clinton, as if somehow the reason Bush was a failure is because Clinton handed him budget surpluses...
Does anyone even remember who which administration started the TARP program??? Not mentioning Bush and his administration for the current state of the economy, is like not acknowledging that 9/11 is what started the "war on terror"...
All this disappearing money will be found in the Camen Islands in a numbered bank account, It is amazing what one can do with a computer.
Come now nathan...the Obama administration is transparent and accountable? More liberal bovine scatology at best. Closed door sessions at the White House wher Republicans were excluded regarding this health care boondogle? Wanting to exclude Fox news from the White House press core? Breaking campaign promises right and left? By the way they have spent 184 billion dollars of the stimulus money. Only about 300,000 jobs have been created. The math, nathan runs out to over 330,000.00 per job.
I didn't vote for Obama or Bush so I can thank people like darrick_04, nathan.evans and those Bush supporters for the stupidity than has run amuck for the past nine years and counting.
:-)
Just because Bush did a horrible job doesn't mean all of a sudden I am suppose to ignore the horrible job done by Obama. Quit whining about Bush and focus on the NOW.
"Just because Bush did a horrible job".... is the slogan for many problems we face today. There is a difference between whining about a past president and not forgetting that the current guy is not the reason we have two wars, an illegal detention camp, bank bailouts, and poor unemployment. It all began before he took office, now it is his job to begin correcting it. He hasn't done everything he should be doing, yet; but then again I never expected solutions to the astronomical amount of problems in ten short months. Every decision or lack of decision made by every single president dating back to George Washington is at least somewhat relevant to life as we know it. Focusing on the "NOW" involves examining the mistakes of the past and making an effort to correct them. New CEO's are usually given much longer than 10 months to turn around struggling companies, one would hope the same or more time will be allotted to the president.
I agree with you to a point Darrick but while you may say Obama has only been on the job for 10 months, the Democrats have been in control of Congress for three years now. I think that is plenty of time to judge in regards to agenda and policy. The last time I checked, Democrats and Republicans agree to the war in Iraq and Afghanistan and have continued funding it. Obama still has not closed Gitmo and bank bailouts were approved by both Democrats and Republicans. You just can't blame everything on Bush just like someone cant blame everything on Obama but it is easier to point a finger at one person than a whole group of individuals.
My major in college was sociology so I know the importance of studying the past and how it relates to the present and society but I also know the consequences of those who get stuck in dogma and rhetoric and are stuck in the past.
According to the official Tennessee State website, there is no such place as Richard City, either, but they still got a grant (sub award 581) for their special school district. It must be REAL special, AND top secret too, huh?
As an addendum, a Google Maps search turned up a suburb of South Pittsburg, TN as going by the name Richard City, but a closer inspection showed only a few streets in the area. I don't know what to make of it, but whatever or whoever it is, they got $303,971 of our hard earned tax dollars!
Well, it's now Memorial Day weekend 2010. How do you "fools for Obama" think things are working out?