City says no to guns, garbage fees

If the city council doesn't trust the citizens of Shelbyville, why should the citizens trust the council?

Well I was one for two on these. Maybe I can throw my new garbage can at the person trying to hurt my family in the park.

Now only the criminals will have guns at the park!

just another step towards communism. just like them telling us how to dress our kids for school. this is a free country, YEAH RIGHT! i agree with you Coony.

Posted by darrick_04 on Thu, Aug 13, 2009, at 10:13 PM

I have to disagree with you here, regardless of which part of the government is telling you what to do in your everyday life, it is still a form of communism. Just because it is of your opinion does not make it the right thing to do nor the right thing for every person.

They started by telling you that you must wear a seat belt in your car...they tell me what I can build on my property...they tell me what I can and can not do on my property.... they tell smokers where they are allowed to smoke and where they weren't...they tell business owners they can not allow those smokers to smoke inside their own business...they tell parents what type of clothing to purchase ..then they tell you that you can't use your cell phone in your car...now they say a person who holds a carry permit is limited to where they can actually carry. What's next? They going to ban radios in cars they are certainly a distraction.

Maybe not one of these things effect any part of your life but will the next ban effect you...will your toes be next to be stepped on? This I'm going to ban this or that because I don't like it is nothing less than communism. And that excuse they keep giving for these bans "It's for your own Good" is getting very old!!!

What if Larry Flint wanted to put a strip club next your local elementary school? Would that would be just fine in your book?

So you support the legalization of cocaine, meth, and heroine?

-- Posted by nathan.evans on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 12:04 AM

Actually yes. Prohibition should have taught everyone that making something illegal only drives up the profit of that item because the risk of incarceration is then factored into the price.

Because the illegal item has a higher price, (addicts in this case) must steal or rob to get enough money to support their habit. Also because of the profit motive gangs kill each other, and bystanders, in wars to protect their "turf".

Two out of three people in the criminal justice system are there for a drug related offense. Because of "mandatory-minimum" sentences for drug offenses prisons let out violent offenders to make room for druggies.

Under the so called "war-on-drugs" we have spent countless trillions, and for what?

I think the new garbage cans are a great defensive weapon.. a little hard to tote for a jot in the park, but still could be used to stuff a crackhead in one in a pinch. They don't weigh much.

;)

Are slapjacks illeal too, i carry one of those..??

"If the city council doesn't trust the citizens of Shelbyville, why should the citizens trust the council?"

it seems that the council does trust the citizens. they trust the citizens enough to vote the way the vast majority preferred.

if you want to be angry at the people who are eroding gun rights, be mad at the people who created the gun carry permit in the first place. when did we start requiring special permits for constitutional rights? what is next, a free speech permit? be mad at the people who, in pandering to a few loud voices, created a ridiculous law that any responsible governing body was bound to strike down.

in a perfect world, a constitutional right would be a constitutional right, and responsible people would recognize that there are appropriate places to be armed, and places where it is inappropriate. unfortunately, not everyone is responsible; so we do have to have laws prohibiting guns in inappropriate places such as courtrooms, ballfields, bars, and swimming pools. instead, those who want to remove your rights, with your acquiescence, created the carry permit laws where they fool you into thinking you have some special right... which they can now further restrict at their leisure. perhaps using the inevitable "incidents" as an excuse to gradually tighten the requirements until only a select few can get a permit. the same people pass laws, again with your enthusiatic support, that serve to make gun rights people come across as a bunch of raving lunatics. do you really know who your friends are?

from what i have seen, lebanon is the only city to get it right. they made their decision on a park by park basis. if you will recall, my position from the beginning was that we would be better served to acknowledge the inappropriateness of allowing guns at ballfields and swimming pools, while arguing that some parks would be appropriate places to allow them. instead ya'll went for all or nothing... and got it. (nothing that is). you could have gotten a delegation of local people, dressed like responsible adults, and gone to the council meeting and offered reasonable arguments for reasonable requests. instead a collection of out-of-towners showed up dressed for a paint-gun war and offered the same old specious arguments that we can read on any of the loony write-in sites. (yes, i am fully aware that makes me one of the loonies who "write in").

so there is nothing to be gained by blaming the council. they only did their job by representing the wishes of the overwhelming majority (dang that democracy stuff). blame yourself for not picking your battles wisely, and once engaged for not taking a course of action that had a real chance of success.

What if Larry Flint wanted to put a strip club next your local elementary school? Would that would be just fine in your book?

-- Posted by nathan.evans on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 12:06 AM

I think it would be no different than Larry Flint or anybody else putting one anywhere in the city.

I do not go to strip clubs or bars in fact drunks are my least favorite people...but yet I am not out here trying to rid the world of them just because I do not like them. Which is something I can not say for the rest of the world.

Plenty of people enjoy bars and strip clubs or they certainly wouldn't be in business. Drunk drivers kill more innocent people every year than anything else...so where is the "It's for your own good here?"

Chef Boy R D,

Yeah I am with ya.

This is in responce to comments by lazarus.

The purpose of having a permit it to identify a trained person from someone that has no skill thus will shoot wildly and injure innocent bystanders and how to know the difference when deadly force is necessary.

A permit lets law enforcement easily identify a non criminal with a clean record versus a guy, with for example, a restraining order and a history of violence.

A permit allows law enforcement to keep track of how many citizens are out there taking responsibility for their own safety thus allowing them to see if crime is a problem or if crime is detered by such citizens.

There are those out there that are not capable of accepting this responsibility but with your logic it would be a free for all such that people would arm themselves for the wrong reasons.

We permit holders are subject to all of the laws as everyone else with the exception that if you have a permit and are caught with a gun where you are not supposed to have it it is a felony. Nonpermit holders get a much lesser charge. We are held to a higher level of punishment than a criminal. Go figure.

like george sodini?

-- Posted by lazarus on Fri, Aug 14, 2009, at 5:07 PM

I usually like your comments lazarus but that is not a very good comparison.

Do you think George Sodini would not have killed if he didn't have a carry permit?? Sodini felt rejected by women, he blogged about killing and no one paid him any attention. I've since read his blog and he was indeed very disturbed. I refuse to believe whether he had a carry permit or not that he would have done anything different. Some people fall off the deep end of the pool whether they have a carry permit or not. Did Sahel Kazemi have a carry permit? No she did not and it did not stop her from obtaining a gun and killing McNair, did it?

Thank Goodness!

A permit allows law enforcement to keep track of how many citizens are out there taking responsibility for their own safety thus allowing them to see if crime is a problem or if crime is detered by such citizens.

by T2.

Why do you think that if carry permit citizens were allowed to carry their guns into the parks it would discourage criminals with guns to carry into the parks? I assure you it would not matter if carry permit citizens had their guns in the parks or not, they would still commit the crime. Carry permit citizens are able to carry their guns everywhere else, stores, in and out of their homes, at restaraunts, and yet crimes are still being committed at all of these same areas. It is not stopping nor is it detouring them to commit a crime one bit!

Shelbyville's stores, restaraunts, banks, and homes have been robbed, people have been jumped on and assaulted on a regular basis in areas where you can carry your gun, but their has not been any report of a crime in Shelbyville Tn. park, except the one where undercover detectives have been telling child predators to meet at. I would not allow my children at this park, for their safety, and some city parks you will need that type of protection at, but I do not feel it is needed here.

I am glad they chose to opt out.

"EVERY municipality that has allowed concealed carry has seen a reduction in crime rates."

cool stat. not a shred of truth in it, but it is a cool stat to toss out there. the other side likes to throw out the stat that permit holders are twice as likely to be convicted of a firearm violation as the population at large. that one is BS, as well, but isnt that what stats are supposed to be? i am a big believer in numbers, but this is one issue on which no reliable data seems to be available. just a bunch of transparently manipulated "stats" used to prop up one argument or another, rather than to illuminate the issue.

truth is, criminals arent looking for unarmed victims. they are looking for unaware victims. being armed is no deterrent. in the hands of a likely victim, a weapon is just another item to steal... probably one of the most liquid stolen properties, next to cash or drugs.

Yawn . . . more posts from Darrick_04 and nathan.evans stating that anyone that doesn't believe what they believe must be ignorant or wrong.

I guess nothing changed while I was on vacation. LOL!

I could care less if they allow guns in the park or not because I don't have one nor would I carry one but it is very na*ve for some to believe that crime rates or incidents with guns would go up because it hasn't in other areas of the country where it is legal and real criminals will still carry a gun into a park no matter if it is legal or not.

banned or not, mine is with me all of the time. it may not be on me, but its within close reach.